Pope: Church Cannot Seek Converts…

Pope: Church Cannot Seek Converts…

Pope: Church Cannot Seek Converts...

Never before in the history of Christian-Jewish relations have a Pope and a Rabbi celebrated their friendship by living in the Vatican together for several days, sharing all meals, including on two Jewish festivals and the Sabbath at which the Rabbi said prayers in Hebrew, and discussing what more they can do together to promote dialogue and peace in the world.

That is what actually happened over the past four days at the Vatican guesthouse (Santa Marta) where Pope Francis lives and where his friend from Buenos Aires, Rabbi Abraham Skorka, has been his guest from September 25 to this day.

“I eat with him at breakfast, lunch and dinner every day. He cares for me, and controls everything regarding my food to makes sure it is all kosher, and according to my religious tradition. These are festive days, and I have to say certain prayers at meals and, I expand the last prayer and translate it. He accompanies me together with the others at table -his secretaries and a bishop, and they all say ‘Amen’ at the end”, the Rabbi said.

By acting in this way, the Pope and Rabbi are sending an extraordinary message of friendship, dialogue and peace not only to their respective religious communities but also to the whole world. And they plan to do even more together, Rabbi Skorka revealed when we talked together at Santa Marta, on September 27.

He and the Pope are planning to travel together to the Holy Land next year. The Israeli and Palestinian authorities have invited Pope Francis, and the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople, Bartholomew1, wants him to celebrate the 50th anniversary of the historic meeting of his predecessor, Athenagoras, with Paul VI in the Holy City…

“We come together without burying our identities. I spoke to him about evangelization, and he stated emphatically that the Catholic Church cannot engage in proselytism”, he said.

Click on the picture to read the entire report. And then tell us your thoughts. Me? I’m fresh out of words to describe Pope Francis. TV and radio news broadcasts today announced his intention of canonising both Pope John XXIII and Pope John Paul II. I mean, what’s the editor of Catholic Truth to say that she’s not already said – loud and clear?

Over to you, folks…

Comments (130)

  • catholicconvert1

    This Pope is driving me to the point of madness and desperation. First the comments on gays, then on cohabiting couples, then on not talking about abortion, contraception and homosexuality. It is the duty of every ordained clergyman from the Pope downwards to preach against sin. What gets my goat is that, I, a convert unflinchingly upholds each and every word that the Catechism says, and yet the Pope does not. On another page, the Editor put up a piece about a man who whilst not Sedevacantist, believed the Pope was not Catholic. He is absolutely correct. His comments are severely limiting his membership of the Church which he leads, and his silence on morals, is encouraging relativism, and therefore, the Pope is living and persisting in a state of heresy. Didn’t St Pius X call relativism a grave sin? Francis would have been reported to the Holy Office. The Pope despises the Papacy, despises the Church and clearly despises Jesus Christ by sitting as an equal with a Rabbi, who is a representative of a diabolical and manmade fabrication of a divine religion. The Pope is disobeying the Magisterium, and dragging the name of his predecessors through the mud. Maybe to learn obedience he should follow Pope Innocent III’s words to St Francis, and ‘go and roll around in the mud with the pigs’.

    As for not seeking converts this is not only an insult to me, Miles and other devoted converts, but also the thousands of missionaries who were martyred for spreading the faith. Because of this relativism will not only creep into the Church, but society, and will serve as an encouragement to secular governments in their mission to dismantle the Laws of God. More people will live in sin and moral perfidy, thus removing the possibility of being saved through Invincible Ignorance and thus more people will achieve not salvation but damnation.

    On another page someone said that when we remove Christ from all things, He removes His protection from us. This happened in the Church. We are being punished because of the emissaries of Satan who wrought Vatican II on the world.

    Here endeth the rant.

    Asperges me, Domine, hyssopo et mundabor.

    September 30, 2013 at 9:59 pm
    • bededog

      I agree with Catholic Convert 100 %. I am very saddened by what is going on in the Catholic Church and I still wonder why exactly did Pope Benedict resign.

      October 4, 2013 at 11:31 am
      • catholicconvert1

        Thanks for your support. There are heresies in the Church today, but I must convert, as God wills it. Francis has excommunicated himself for his erroneous opinions. Monsignor Lefbvre was excommunicated for much less than what Francis has done. He is leading the Church eyes wide open to perdition. He must be an anti-Pope by now. Is the See of Peter vacant?

        October 5, 2013 at 3:21 pm
  • Margaret Mary

    “On another page, the Editor put up a piece about a man who whilst not Sedevacantist, believed the Pope was not Catholic. He is absolutely correct.”

    I also think that man was correct. This pope isn’t a Catholic, by any stretch of the imagination.

    When I heard them announcing that he is to canonise Popes John XXIII and John Paul II, I was already thinking that something big is sure to happen soon. Now that I’ve read about this friendship with the rabbi and the pope saying the Church cannot proselytise I am just speechless. What about all the canonised saints who were missionaries and gave their lives to proselytising?

    It’s beyond belief, it really is.

    October 1, 2013 at 12:29 am
  • Margaret Mary

    I forgot to say Catholic Convert that I hope you don’t despair because this is all part of the chastisement, I’m sure of it. The Church itself cannot fail, despite bad and even heretical popes. Oremus!

    October 1, 2013 at 12:31 am
    • John Skacklefree

      Yes. I do think we are in the end times. When talkng about that time Jesus says that there will be signs and wonder to deceive even the elect. Read Matthew 25 where Jesus speaks about the End Times and compare it with our current times

      October 4, 2013 at 6:50 pm
  • Margaret Mary


    I was also taken by this in your comment: “I, a convert unflinchingly upholds each and every word that the Catechism says, and yet the Pope does not”

    Catholic Convert, that is just so incredible and must really test your zeal for the faith. Please don’t give up. God is above it all and it will all come right again, somehow. I keep wondering if something will happen on the 13th October when the Pope consecrates the world? Or on the day of the canonisations? I shudder to think.

    October 1, 2013 at 12:33 am
    • catholicconvert1

      I know what will happen on that day. Francis will get zapped and St Pius X will come down from Heaven. You are a good woman, and I’m grateful for your support, after all Popes may have errors, but the Church does not.

      October 1, 2013 at 12:58 pm
  • editor

    Catholic Convert & Margaret Mary,

    Absolutely right – nobody should lose faith because of the antics of this pontiff.

    I’m always nervous when I Google “Pope Francis latest” and when this report appeared just now, on the topic of the forthcoming meeting between the pontiff and the group (Council) of Cardinals chosen by him to advise him on reform of the curia, I felt more nervous than ever. This bit in particular worries me, where the Pope’s spokesman says: “A council advises, and he who decides is the pope.”

    THAT, of course, is the problem. Pope Francis is liable to dissolve the Vatican congregations one and all, and replace them with some new-fangled ecumenical body to re-think every doctrine from Original Sin to the Resurrection.

    One really does wonder how much worse things can get before one really does reach the end of one’s tether. Doesn’t one? Or is one quite alone in one’s nervousness?

    What the heck – I’m off pubbing and clubbing. See you all when they run out of Diet Coke…

    October 1, 2013 at 1:07 am
    • catholicconvert1

      What are you on about ‘Diet Coke’? If the ‘End Times’ are coming go for the full fat. It won’t affect your sleek and glamorous figure.

      October 5, 2013 at 3:23 pm
  • Thurifer

    It’s a work of charity to admonish the sinner. And to tell our neighbor the truth of the Catholic Faith.

    Well our Lord will chastise for our sins, great and small, mortal and venial, either in this life or in the next. That’s why our Lady at Fatima requested that we perform penance. We can never undertake enough penance; it’s our duty! In light of the vision of the chastisement of Akita, and that then Cardinal Ratzinger stated in 1984 that the message of Akita is the same as Fatima, I think (and mind you this is only my opinion so I could be totally wrong) that the chastisement in the Third Secret is going to be meteors or a large comet falling to the Earth, killing millions, maybe even billions. This vision of a great star falling is in the Book of the Apocalypse.

    The one thing that pushed me to this belief is the numerous news stories of meteors falling towards the sky, especially the one that injured many people in Russia earlier this year.

    October 1, 2013 at 4:23 am
  • 3littleshepherds

    Yves Dupont wrote a book on prophecy with an illustration of a comet on the cover. I think there are prophecies that actually predict a comet. One thing’s for sure, whatever happens no one will be able to do anything about it. Not the U.N., not the U.S., nobody. Everyone’s going to have kneel down and pray because there will be no human help.

    October 1, 2013 at 8:13 am
    • John Skacklefree

      I read that book years ago and one mystic, (I think it was Catherine Emmerich) mentions that one of the things that surprised her was how many priests and nuns were in hell. There are many prophecies predicting a great chastisement and that the Catholic Church would sink very low as to be almost extinguished. However this is to be followed by a glorious resurrection. We are surely being tested.

      October 4, 2013 at 6:56 pm
  • Leo

    Here’s one for the files.

    I think that many here will have heard of Father Michael Rodriguez, a courageous and exemplary pastor of souls and defender of the Truth, who has been sent to the wilds of West Texas. That Father Rodriguez offers the Mass of All Time exclusively is rather telling, and not in the least bit surprising.

    The term comprehensive barely begins to do justice to this magnificent instruction in the Faith. It should be spread far and wide. Don’t take my word for it.


    October 1, 2013 at 10:13 am
    • Eileenanne

      I remember hearing about Fr Rodriguez a while ago. Has anyone heard the outcome of the financial investigation at his previous parish?

      October 1, 2013 at 10:28 am
      • crofterlady

        Are you implying that Fr. Rodriguez was dishonest in some way?

        October 1, 2013 at 12:16 pm
      • Eileenanne

        I don’t know whether he was dishonest, but there was an investigation by his Bishop at the time Fr Rodriguez was moved to a different parish. It looked as if he wasn’t very good at keeping his accounts properly, but I never heard the end of the story. I just wondered if anyone else had. We discussed it on the old forum. As this is off topic, I’ll se what I can find and post the link on General Discussion.

        October 1, 2013 at 12:46 pm
  • Augustine

    It gets worse. This is from his latest interview:

    Proselytism is solemn nonsense, it makes no sense.

    This is a new low. No matter what the shovel brigade say about ‘misinterpretation’, this explicitly rejects Christ’s Great Commission to the Apostles (Matthew 28:16-20).

    October 1, 2013 at 12:09 pm
    • Eileenanne


      Remember what you are reading is a translation and meanings can get a bit skewed. My understanding of the word “Proselytism” is that it implies some sort of force or coercion in converting people. It is not the same as evangelisation, which gives those outside the Church a glimpse of the treasures within and invites them to learn more. I simply do not believe the Pope is against evangelisation.

      October 1, 2013 at 12:49 pm
      • editor


        Definition of verb “to proselytise” = to try to persuade people to join a religion, cause, or group (some dictionaries read “to invite” or “to recruit” – no mention of coercion). If Pope Francis had meant “no question of using force to recruit” I think the he would have said so – and/or his minions would have been rushing to the nearest microphone to explain that that’s really what he meant. Heavens, if someone had to explain my every word, I think I’d hang up my keyboard and settle down with a pile of John Grisham novels for the next couple of years. Ridiculous. If words mean anything, Pope Francis means what he says. Remember, the Rabbi was speaking to the Pope in the context of discussing “evangelisation” … The clear import of what the Pope was saying to him was “don’t worry, I cannot seek to convert you!” I mean, if this were a question on the GCSE Religious Studies paper the pupils would consider it a no-brainer.

        I truly do not know what it will take for modern Catholics to realise that we have a very bad pope. That the Church is in crisis, big time.

        What will it take, Eileenanne?

        October 1, 2013 at 4:45 pm
      • Eileenanne

        I think proselytise has adifferent nuance from evangelisation with more negative connotations.Who knows which word His Holiness would have used if he had been speaking English? We only get the slant the translators put on his words.

        October 2, 2013 at 2:58 pm
    • editor


      Thanks for that. It’s truly incredible. Just as well we all know that the indefectibility of the Church does not depend on having a good pope, and that we understand all too well the difference between true and false obedience. Listening to the majority of Catholics trying to defend the indefensible statements and actions of Pope Francis is more painful by far than watching an Orange Walk.

      I thought the following comment from the Pope, describing what happened after his election, of particular interest. He said this:

      …when the conclave elected me Pope. Before I accepted I asked if I could spend a few minutes in the room next to the one with the balcony overlooking the square. My head was completely empty and I was seized by a great anxiety. To make it go way and relax I closed my eyes and made every thought disappear, even the thought of refusing to accept the position, as the liturgical procedure allows. I closed my eyes and I no longer had any anxiety or emotion. At a certain point I was filled with a great light. It lasted a moment, but to me it seemed very long. Then the light faded, I got up suddenly and walked into the room where the cardinals were waiting and the table on which was the act of acceptance. I signed it, the Cardinal Camerlengo countersigned it and then on the balcony there was the ‘”Habemus Papam”.

      However, before the papolatrists scream “mystical experience, the Pope’s OK after all” let’s reflect on the following words of warning from St Paul:

      For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. (2 Corinthians 11:13-14)

      October 1, 2013 at 5:25 pm
      • 3littleshepherds

        Shudder. Why doesn’t he think to bless himself with holy water and say a prayer to St. Michael?!

        October 1, 2013 at 6:05 pm
      • Lily


        I think because he doesn’t see that there is anything wrong in what he is saying and doing.

        I found it curious that the rabbi said prayers in Hebrew while with the Pope in the Vatican these past days, but the Pope wouldn’t dream of saying anything, even Grace, in Latin.

        October 1, 2013 at 10:14 pm
      • 3littleshepherds


        Exactly. Even if the Pope said the basic Catholic grace before meals he would say, “through Christ Our Lord” and the Rabbi wouldn’t say Amen to that, I would think.

        October 1, 2013 at 10:46 pm
      • catholicconvert1

        No, the Rabbi wouldn’t that’s the best bit. Jews and all of the other fake religions want respect, but refuse to respect Catholicism. I have not respect for Judaisms and the faithless Jews.

        October 7, 2013 at 9:51 pm
  • bradders

    Like most of you i am scandalised by pope francis, what he does, doesn’t do and above all what he says. From the minute he appeared on the loggia the night of his election my blood ran cold. I think too that the crowd’s initial silence at his presence spoke volumes. The shock for me never abated and increases daily like some infernal virus. Hence diabolical disorientation in spades. But who now is ‘the bishop in white’ being pursued out of a ruined Vatican?

    October 1, 2013 at 12:30 pm
    • editor


      I believe that the “bishop in white” is quite likely to be Pope Benedict XVI. When the children of Fatima mentioned this “bishop in white”, remember, they added “we had the impression it was the Holy Father.” Not that it WAS the Holy Father. Yet in another vision they saw the Holy Father crying…

      I recall thinking of that (“we had the impression…”) immediately when I heard that Pope Benedict intended to continue to wear the white. As Christopher Ferrara said in an article at the time, it’s only when prophecies are unfolding before us, that we can truly begin to make sense of them.

      October 1, 2013 at 4:53 pm
      • Bradders


        I though about Benedict too in this context but I’m confused here: the children of Fatima, as you say, were given an impression of ‘a bishop in white’ fleeing Rome in terror and being martyred as a result. It’s not clear, but then prophecies generally aren’t, e.g., Isaiah 7:14 only becomes clear at the Annunciation and Virgin Birth. However, I can’t see Benedict lasting too long now and a natural death could well exclude him from the vision. But who knows? He could outlive a lot of us! It’s still amazing how things are unfolding but the terrible thought struck me that the bishop in white (the ‘Bishop of Rome’, as Francis prefers) could be sent packing by disaffected Catholics. It’s the opposite scenario to the enemies of the Church descending on Rome and sacking the place.

        October 1, 2013 at 6:53 pm
      • Petrus


        You are right to be concerned. The one thing I would say is that it is unlikely Pope Francis would be hounded out of the Vatican by disaffected Catholics – most liberals love him!

        Could it be that Pope Benedict has already been hounded out? “The Pope fleeing the Vatican”??? I read an article yesterday that claimed Pope Benedict could join Pope Francis in canonising JPII and JXXIII. I dread to think what might happen when Pope Benedict appears in public.

        One thing is for sure – the thought in my head since the last conclave is this: “Come back Pope Benedict – all is forgiven!”

        October 1, 2013 at 7:22 pm
      • editor


        I think the fact of the matter is that we don’t have long to wait for this major event which will threaten the world and the Church, so Pope Benedict’s age may simply be an indicator that events are moving very fast towards the final chastisement.

        I doubt very much if your scenario of “disaffected Catholics” has any mileage. I wish there were sufficient Catholics motivated to sack Rome! Most Catholics are quite happy with the state of the Church, less hassle for them than having faithful priests, bishops and popes banging on about morality and fidelity to Catholic doctrine.

        Putting together the state of the Church, the geo-political developments and the warnings of Our Lady at Fatima and Akita, I think something very serious will occur, which I’m afraid to put into words for publication. Let’s say “war” without any adjectives springs to mind. I could, of course, be wrong, and this is one of those occasions when I hope, fervently, that I am wrong!

        October 1, 2013 at 7:26 pm
      • Petrus


        Fancy a trip to Rome? Why don’t we go and sack Rome? I know you have a devotion to St. Therese, but I see more of St. Catherine in you!

        October 1, 2013 at 7:31 pm
      • editor


        Having been to Rome a couple of times, I’m in no hurry to return but if I do return any day soon, it will be to sob, not to sack!

        I am now awaiting my phone call from the Pope – he will see his picture on the front page of the current newsletter and my phone number on page 8 so if he doesn’t take the hint, I’ll write a personal letter with my phone number right under where I write Dear Pope Francis…

        You never know – although what we’d have in common to talk about, beats me. He seems much more at home chatting with atheists and rabbis than with the likes of moi.

        Bishop Fellay eat your heart out! If you’d been a left wing dissenter instead of a “right winger” YOU’D have gotten a phone call, too!

        October 1, 2013 at 7:46 pm
      • Bradders

        Editor, Petrus,

        ‘Disaffected Catholics’: too weak on my part. I shouldn’t let my imagination run riot on this but I was thinking more about a Mumbai/Nairobi scenario where the threat comes from outside the Vatican with the aid of a well ensconced fifth column of Catholic gunmen. The stuff of Dan Brown, perhaps.

        In any case, I pray that some divine punishment is not imminent as a result of Francis’ destructive liberalism. His antics (I though the carnival was over?) are, or should be, a great concern for all Catholics, but let’s consider for a minute that this fiasco of a papacy will hopefully, in time, force Catholics to look more seriously at what Catholic Truth and like-minded blogs have been warning about for years: distilling the Truth, subverting tradition and destroying the liturgy will do to the Church what Luther’s ‘deformation’ failed to do. The worst enemies of the Church are within its own doors.

        October 1, 2013 at 10:30 pm
      • John Skacklefree

        All this makes me think of the words of Jesus “so when you see the disastrous abomination of which the prophet Daniel spoke set up the holy place …” At this stage we cannot be sure but as Jesus said, read the signs of the times and he mentioned about the twigs and leaves on the fig tree becoming supple as a sign that his coming will be soon. The Fig tree has been understood to refer to Israel and in 1947 the United mandate gave them a home in Palestine. Jesus significantly said. In truth I tell you, before this generation has passed away, all these things will have taken place. The generation that begun with the establishment of the Jewish state (as prophesied by Daniel 2600 years ago), has not yet passed and that is the generation Jesus was talking about when he answered the apostles about when he would return.

        October 4, 2013 at 8:02 pm
  • catholicconvert1

    Where in the Third Secret does it comment on a star hitting the Earth? I’ve read the ‘official’ version, and it mentions the ‘Bishop in white’ and Bishops, Clergy and Laity going up a mountain and being martyred, but nothing about a star.

    October 1, 2013 at 1:05 pm
    • Whistleblower


      I don’t think I’ve heard that a star will hit the earth. Nothin I’ve read on the Third Secret suggests that. By the way, you asked “Where in the Third Secret”….that’s almost impossible to answer because we’ve never been given the full thing.

      October 1, 2013 at 5:25 pm
  • Leo


    As far as I know, there has not been any conclusion to the lawsuit brought by his then outgoing bishop against Father Rodriguez.

    I think anyone looking for evidence of financial impropriety in this case will be gone some time. I don’t believe for one second that Father Rodriguez is a thief, or that any great exercise of mental powers is required to see what is behind the bishop’s actions.

    As you say, Eileenanne, this is off topic, but I think the following should help readers form their own judgement.


    The following video interview, in addition to being very well worth watching in any event, adds, in my opinion, some very relevant context to the banishment of Father Rodriguez.


    I have another US secular newspaper report, and video that I will be happy to post on the General Discussion thread.

    October 1, 2013 at 1:50 pm
    • editor


      Thanks for that – it is painfully obvious that Fr Rodriguez was set up. I’d trust him with UK finances before I’d trust George Osborne.

      October 1, 2013 at 5:28 pm
      • Eileenanne

        It was also quite clear that his accounts were not well kept and that the Bishop was right to have a closer look.

        October 2, 2013 at 2:59 pm
      • editor

        Did he take a close look at the accounts in every other parish?

        October 2, 2013 at 8:49 pm
      • Eileenanne

        No idea, but I think it is a Bishop’s duty to keep an eye on parish finances and accounting, so why not?

        October 3, 2013 at 10:28 am
  • 3littleshepherds

    I read the Holy Father’s interview, the part published on Rorate coeli. I do not, no way, no how, see any of St. Francis of Assisi in the post Vatican II Popes. He was perfectly ordered, loving God, The Blessed Trinity, with all of his mind, all of His heart and soul. His love and respect for Our Lord Jesus Christ would never have allowed the horrible sacrileges that take place today. St. Francis would be like John Vennari (I think that’s who it was) who knelt in the mud after one of Pope John Paul’s World Youth Days Masses consuming the Blessed Sacrament left alone dirty, disrespected and trampled upon. That’s love and that’s humility. It isn’t love to allow all these sacrileges to take place.

    October 1, 2013 at 7:48 pm
    • Lily


      I never knew that about John Vennari, although I’d heard about the disgrace of Hosts being found discarded at these WYD meetings. Yes, that’s love and humility, not telling atheists that they don’t need the Church.

      October 1, 2013 at 10:10 pm
  • 3littleshepherds

    I also think that these interviews with Atheists and others are very soft interviews. An interview conducted by the SSPX will never happen because they would ask questions that go to the very core. I don’t think there are any good answers for the questions they would ask.
    I also think that Our Lord will convert one of His Pontiffs by allowing the world to hate him the way the world hates Our Lord.

    October 1, 2013 at 8:14 pm
  • Leo

    “The Law and the Prophets were until John: from that time the kingdom of God is preached and every one useth violence towards it” – Luke 16: 15-16

    The subject of this thread is yet one more manifestation of the toxic Conciliar programme of religious indifferentism. What words can express the gravity of all this? What value is now placed on the salvation of souls? The masonic programme of universal brotherhood and the spirit of Assisi have so intoxicated and disorientated the vast majority of Catholics that to talk of scandal and the Church’s infallible doctrine of outside the Church there is no salvation, will more than likely draw charges of bigotry, intolerance and narrow mindedness. We can now of course add “judgemental”, “restorationist”, and “legalist” to the progressivist lexicon.

    Here’s a few relevant talking points to be used when addressing papolatrists, or better still, to be included in the Pope’s dinner table conversation at the Santa Marta.

    “There is indeed a setting aside of the former commandment, because of the weakness and unprofitableness thereof. For the law brought nothing to perfection…” – Hebrews 7:18-19

    “In saying a new, He (Christ) hath made the former old. And that which decayeth and groweth old, is near its end.” Hebrew 8:13

    “The first consideration is that the ceremonies of the Mosaic Law were abrogated by the coming of Christ and that they can no longer be observed without sin after the promulgation of the Gospel.” – Pope Benedict XIV, Ex Quo Primum, #61, 1756

    “It (the Catholic Church) firmly believes, professes and teaches that the matter pertaining to the law of the Old Testament, of the Mosaic law, which are divided into ceremonies, sacred rites, sacrifices, and sacraments, because they were established to signify something in the future, although they were suited to divine worship at the time, after Our Lord’s coming had been signified by them, ceased, and the sacraments of the New Testament began…After promulgation of the Gospel which it (the Church) asserts that they (the Old Testament sacraments) cannot be observed without the loss of eternal salvation. All, therefore, who after that time observe circumcision and the Sabbath and the other requirements of the law, it declares alien to the Christian faith and not in the least fit to participate in eternal salvation, unless someday they recover from these errors.” – Council of Florence, Denzinger- Schonmetzer 712

    I can just imagine what Saint Paul would be doing and saying in if he was with us today. And I don’t think he would easily fobbed off with mumbled excuses from papal aides about the Holy Father being in a meeting.

    October 1, 2013 at 11:25 pm
  • editor

    I have just received an email from a reader who lives in England. It is very interesting indeed, given his ability to check the Pope’s original statements in Italian. He writes:

    I wanted to congratulate you on your broadcast by telephone regarding our new Pope’s views. In fact, Catholic Truth Magazine has been excellent for a long time – it always was, of course!

    The statements of Francis seem to get worse every day. His La Repubblicca interview with Scalfari is possibly the most damaging. I note that your blog has covered his statement that proselytism is nonsense. That is an appalling statement. However, far worse is his statement about conscience. He says that each one of us has his own vision of good and evil and we must not try to persuade someone to go against what he perceives to be good. He was questioned on this by Scalfari and repeated it saying: “I repeat it here: each person has his own idea of Good and Evil and must choose to follow Good and combat Evil as he conceives of it. This would be enough to make the world better.”

    I checked the original Italian in the hope that he may have been mistranslated but the translation is correct. The implications of this statement are obviously enormous. So much for relativism and the necessity of an informed conscience. Obviously we were all wrong according to him.

    The Pope was, however, mistranslated in what appeared to be another theological blunder. In the version from Rorate Coeli that your blogger Augustine provided with a translation provided by La Repubblicca, the Pope is quoted as saying: “The Son of God became incarnate in the souls of men to instill the feeling of brotherhood”.

    How Christ’s body could be in the soul seemed rather problematical so I checked what the Pope said in the original Italian and it is rather different. He said: “The Son of God became incarnate to infuse into the soul of men the sentiment of brotherhood.” Whereas one might cavill at the use of “soul” in the singular in relation to men in the plural, suggesting some concept akin to the Jungian idea of a collective unconscious, the reference to the incarnation at least makes sense, although I think we old traditionalists might suggest that The Son of God became incarnate to carry out the Redemption of Man, with the offer of release from Original Sin through the Sacrament of Baptism and therefore the possibility of eternal happiness and the Beatific Vision, but there we are. It does suggest that we will need to check what he originally says in case we jump the gun and challenge him on something he did not say. What he does actually say is bad enough. END.

    I would add, however, that it is unlikely that any serious mistranslation would be allowed to stand without correction by the papal spokeman, Fr Lombardi, who is not slow to head for the microphone when he thinks something needs clarification.

    October 2, 2013 at 9:57 am
    • scottish priest

      big discussion on American websites about the mistranslation and how left wing la republica is and that the papal household have no intention of adding fuel tot he fire by correcting etc,, not sure how true but good source

      October 3, 2013 at 11:56 am
      • editor

        Would you provide the link, Scottish Priest, so that we can decide for ourselves just how “good” this source is. From your brief comment above, it seems the American bloggers are under the impression that the left wing La Repubblica is reporting the pope’s words second hand – far from it. He GAVE them the interview. I suggest that he knew only too well to whom he was speaking. Would you give an interview to a publication naturally opposed to the Church, unless your every word was in line with the Tradition of the Church, and could not be twisted to suit their agenda? He knew exactly what he was saying and to whom. The very idea that he could “change the Church” should have been stamped upon immediately, instead of being allowed to make headlines around the world.

        As for the American’s suggestion that the Vatican is not correcting, not to add fuel to fire – that is patent nonsense. And it’s a first. Fr Lombardi jumps in all the time in damage-limitation mode. Odd that he should choose not to correct the two very worst interviews by far. No. The only possible reason can be that the pope meant what he said and won’t allow any “clarification”.

        It seems that when this pope speaks, words never mean what they usually mean.

        It also seems that when a pope is speaking to an atheist and a rabbi, his words are saying the opposite of what a pope should be saying, the opposite of what the Church teaches, whether about conscience, evangelisation, or salvation in false religions. Instead of recognising and lamenting that and taking some comfort from the apparitions warning us of this diabolical disorientation, the modernist Catholics prefer to scream “mistranslation”.

        So, please let have the link so that we can see what gems of wisdom the American bloggers have posted to contradict the conclusion I have come to, which is … I was wrong about Pope John Paul II. He’s NOT the worst ever pope in history – this latest pontiff has already earned that title.

        October 3, 2013 at 1:02 pm
      • scottish priest

        I see
        It was sent in a text but will try and find out

        October 4, 2013 at 9:46 am
      • editor

        Scottish Priest,

        Please don’t go to any bother to get the link – I think it’s quite clear that those American bloggers are exactly like the modernist bloggers over here – they are papolatrists and if the Pope speaks, they hear the Holy Spirit.

        I posted the following information below, in response to Nolite Timere – for ease of reference, I will re-post it here:

        “The Catholic world has been shaken by the recent interview with Pope Francis appearing in the Jesuit journal, La Civiltà Cattolica [Italian for Catholic Civilization, it is a periodical published since 1850 without interruptions by the Jesuits in Rome. It is among the oldest of Catholic Italian periodicals and is directly revised by the Secretariat of State of the Holy See before being published.] ” Source

        October 4, 2013 at 9:58 am
  • leprechaun

    Pope Francis has announced the formation of a “College of Cardinals”:

    For this reason, on the past April 13, I announced the constitution of the aforementioned group, indicating at the same time the names of those who were called to take part in it. Now, upon mature reflection, I consider appropriate that this group, by way of the present Chirograph, be instituted as a “Council of Cardinals”, with the competence of aiding me in the government of the universal Church and to study a project of revision of the Apostolic Constitution Pastor Bonus on the Roman Curia. It will be composed of the same persons indicated before, which may be consulted, as Council or individually, on the maters that I consider from time to time worthy of attention. The aforesaid Council, whose number of components I reserve the right to configurate in the manner that will prove to be more adequate, will be an ulterior expression of the episcopal communion and of the aid to the munus petrinum that the Episcopate spread throughout the world may offer.”

    Could that mean that this small and personally selected group will be empowered to elect the next pope, instead of the current, larger and much more diverse Cardinalate?

    That would be one way of ensuring that the “right” man got the keys to the Kingdom, would it not?

    I feel that the time is fast approaching when God will call “Time” on this pantomime, and then will come the great chastisement and the separating of the tares from the wheat.

    October 2, 2013 at 2:05 pm
    • Margaret Mary


      I read somewhere recently that Pope Francis is thinking of appointing a female cardinal. Is this possible?

      October 4, 2013 at 12:30 pm
      • 3littleshepherds

        I read that, too. It was on The Remnant site.

        October 4, 2013 at 7:04 pm
      • catholicconvert1

        How can a woman be made a Cardinal? Doesn’t one have to be consecrated a Bishop? And to be a Bishop doesn’t one need to be a Priest?

        October 7, 2013 at 9:54 pm
      • 3littleshepherds

        A Deacon can be a Cardinal, so…

        October 7, 2013 at 10:04 pm
      • Whistleblower

        What on earth makes you think a woman can be a Cardinal???

        October 7, 2013 at 10:22 pm
      • Josephine


        I’m not sure how accurate this report is, as I don’t think the Pope is quoted, but this was all over the internet this week. I was surprised not to see it discussed here.

        October 7, 2013 at 10:25 pm
  • Miles Immaculatae

    I cannot keep up with the many alarming actions and statements which the Holy Father has performed.

    This pretty much sums up all of them:

    I believe in God, not in a Catholic God, there is no Catholic God

    Pope Francis, La Repubblica

    October 2, 2013 at 7:32 pm
    • Margaret Mary

      That’s incredible. I wonder what God this pope believes in then?

      October 4, 2013 at 12:30 pm
      • Miles Immaculatae

        I wonder what God this pope believes in then?

        The answer to this question, MARGARET MARY:

        The God of Religious Liberty, which is the God of the 1789 Revolution, which is the God of Freemasonry, which is the God of Indifferentism.

        I am not saying the Holy Father is a Freemason, but he is poisoned with the beliefs and ideals of Freemasonry.

        This has been the supreme aspiration of Freemasonry since its inception, that is, to infect the Chair of Peter with the Credo of the Lodge. And they have succeeded. Just as it was outlined in the Alta Vendita. They succeeded over half a century ago.

        Like any virus, with time things can only get worse. We were all expecting this Pope. This is the Inevitable Pope.

        I must learn not to complain. This is part of the Chastisement.

        October 4, 2013 at 12:57 pm
      • Margaret Mary

        Miles Immaculatae,

        It’s hard to know whether to be terrified or privileged to live in these times. I can’t imagine any time when it would have been more difficult to be a Catholic.

        October 4, 2013 at 1:12 pm
      • 3littleshepherds

        I remember Fr. Gruner once said that St. Therese said she would like to live during the time of the anti-christ. Fr. Gruner said, Oh, St. Therese, I wish I could have lived in YOUR time!

        October 4, 2013 at 4:47 pm
      • John Skacklefree

        I think Edmund Campion and John Ogilvie had to endure pretty severe times. We are not there yet but the day may come.

        October 4, 2013 at 8:11 pm
      • 3littleshepherds

        At least it’s more black and white. I believe Bishop de Galarreta when he said that Rome moving closer to Tradition seemed to him more dangerous, more confusing and more seductive. It’s a good point I think. Look at the poor conservatives at Father Z’s! It’s so hard on them. They put alot of Faith in Pope Benedict. And Fr. Z trying so hard to calm them down. This just shows the lack of depth in that blog in my opinion. At least they’ve gotten a wake-up-call.

        October 4, 2013 at 5:16 pm
      • Miles Immaculatae

        I couldn’t agree more. My thoughts exactly. Ambiguity is fertile soil for disorientation. Benedict’s was an ambiguous papacy: we gotSummorum Pontificum, but we also got the Extraordinary Form. At least with this Pope we know where we stand. If the church is dichotomised then all those ‘conservatives’ who are in a state of abject denial with be convulsed into reality.

        October 4, 2013 at 10:14 pm
      • catholicconvert1

        Talking of God and who worships Him. I was in a conversion with two Catholic friends, who said that Catholics and Muslims, Jews all worship the same God, but because the Catholic Church is the ‘deposit of Faith’, our beliefs about the nature of God (i.e Trinity) are correct and theirs are wrong, because as Catholicism is true and faultless, no other religion can contradict it. But I said, to worship God truly one must believe that God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit are God in the Holy Trinity, which of course the Jews and Muslims don’t accept, therefore cannot believe in the same God. If a Catholic accepts this then they reject Christ. We’ve spoken about this before but tell me what else I can say to convince them?

        October 7, 2013 at 10:10 pm
  • 3littleshepherds

    I’m only reading critical analysis of the Holy Father’s interviews. These interviews seem like his teaching tool and although I love him for Our Lord’s sake, I am very certain I don’t want to be taught anything against the Faith.

    October 2, 2013 at 8:55 pm
    • editor

      Well, 3LittleShepherds, if you listen or read his interviews, you most definitely WILL be taught plenty against the Faith. Instead of reading “critical analysis” of the Pope’s interviews, I suggest you read them yourself with a fully critical mind, and weigh each statement about the Faith and Morals against what we know to be the infallible teaching of the Church. So far, I’ve found only one sentence in his interviews which is true, given his baptism, albeit laughable, and that is where he claims to be “a son of the Church”. From memory, just about everything else he says is shocking to anyone with a clear Catholic mind.

      October 3, 2013 at 1:13 pm
  • Nolite Timere

    Dearest Ed

    Yesterday you said

    “You never know – although what we’d have in common to talk about, beats me. He seems much more at home chatting with atheists and rabbis than with the likes of moi.”

    Sounds a bit like the actions of Jesus, eating with the sinners and outcasts etc

    Maybe the current Pontiff is just acting like the Vicar of Christ??

    October 2, 2013 at 10:47 pm
    • 3littleshepherds

      Nolite Timere

      Wait until she reads that! It’s not going to be pretty.

      October 2, 2013 at 11:23 pm
      • editor


        You know me so well! My none too pretty response is now posted below – I hope you are not disappointed!

        October 3, 2013 at 10:14 am
    • editor

      Nolite Timere,

      Nope. No way is the current pontiff “just acting like the Vicar of Christ”.

      For starters, moi is a sinner, too, and an outcast par excellence, so that argument falls at the first hurdle.

      For main course, Our Lord was seeking converts – not telling the sinners and outcasts with whom He wined and dined to just follow their consciences and decide for themselves what is good and evil. His message was “repent and believe” and putting those words together with all the other words establishing His Church and the Sacraments, I rather think Our Lord’s words to the atheist and the rabbi would have been very different indeed to the weak populist words of the current pontiff. They would have been along the lines (if we are to believe the Church Fathers) “outside the Catholic Church there is no salvation – so repent, believe, convert”!

      Obviously, all of us, Pope included, have to be thoughtful about how we approach evangelisation. But “being thoughtful” is a long way from saying “we cannot proselytise.” A very long way.

      For dessert…do I take it, Nolite Timere, that you have no problems at all with the reported words of Pope Francis? Do you believe, as I heard one person say yesterday in conversation about this that “the Holy Spirit is guiding the pope every time he speaks”? Is that what you think?

      October 3, 2013 at 10:13 am
  • Leo


    Father Rodriguez’s Bishop did rather more than “have a closer look”. He filed a law suit.

    If anyone is inclined to think the issue is one of bookkeeping, I think the following link should help them get a more realistic grasp of what has happened.


    I’m happy to take the opportunity to post the following link also. It has nothing to do with financial records, but shows the calibre of priest that Father Rodriguez is, and, in my opinion, helps explain the whole story. I think it is a video that could be posted on any number of threads on this blog.

    October 2, 2013 at 11:41 pm
    • Eileenanne

      It seems that lawsuit has yet to be settled so we will know eventually.

      October 3, 2013 at 10:32 am
    • crofterlady

      Wow, Leo, that is one cracking video! What a great priest!

      October 3, 2013 at 11:38 am
    • Josephine


      That’s a great video – what a marvellous priest. No wonder the bishop is trying to discredit him. It’s now the usual MO – support the dissenters, discredit the traditionalists.

      The sad thing is, the neo-cons fall for it every time.

      October 3, 2013 at 7:21 pm
  • crofterlady


    October 3, 2013 at 12:25 pm
    • editor


      Your link is very interesting indeed. A reader in Glasgow emailed me the thoughts of the editor of Inside the Vatican – Robert Moynihan, alias the Eternal Optimist.

      Read it here – worth reading because it includes a gem of a letter from Professor Germain Grisez

      October 3, 2013 at 7:38 pm
  • gabriel syme

    I originally posted this on the General Dicussion thread in error. It is more relevant to this discussion here:

    .Archbishop Gerhard Mueller, (of all people!), offers some much needed correction / clarity following the Pope’s recent confusing / shambolic comments.


    – rejects the idea that the Church is “obsessed” with homosexuality and abortion and the idea that doctrine can be put to the side in favour of pastoral care (as the media have suggested). He explains that pastoral care is in fact the product of doctrine.

    – Says Francis adheres “unconditionally” to Church doctrine and, as Pope, behaves like a local pastor. (I think this point about behaving like a local pastor is an issue – because the Pope is a global leader, not a local pastor.)

    – Rubbishes the idea that power might be “devolved” from the Vatican to Bishops Conferences. He says these conferences are mere work groups and have no authority or competence of their own. He highlights that the Papacy is legitimised by divine law, Bishops Conferences are not.

    I feel a bit better after these comments, but wouldnt it be better if the Pope would engage his brain before his mouth to ensure no ambiguity / double meanings.


    October 3, 2013 at 1:25 pm
    • Margaret Mary

      Gabriel Syme,

      That is really interesting when even the liberal ++ Mueller feels the need to correct Pope Francis.

      I agree completely that it would be better if the Pope engaged his brain before his mouth. On the other hand, perhaps he’s just being honest and he doesn’t believe Catholic teaching on everything?

      October 3, 2013 at 5:42 pm
  • 3littleshepherds

    I read the first interview. When the second one came out I just happened to be reading, “The Catechism against Modernism” and Pope St. Pius X sure was keen about destroy any bridge between modernism and the minds of the faithful. What if the Pope just keeps at it every week? I’m more comfortable when his words come with specific warnings on the same page.

    October 3, 2013 at 3:46 pm
    • editor

      That’s a good point, 3LittleShepherds. I’m choking on my humble pie!

      October 3, 2013 at 4:48 pm
  • editor

    A reader in the north of England emailed me a link to this article claiming that Pope Benedict XVI himself sees Pope Francis as having undermined Summorum Pontificum.

    The plot thickens!

    October 3, 2013 at 5:45 pm
  • 3littleshepherds

    Anybody can ask Archbishop Mueller and Pope Francis if they believe in the Dogmas of the Faith and expect an affirmative answer. The real question is What is Dogma? Is Dogma an absolute truth? Or is it a symbol, an instrument that can evolve? That’s the nitty gritty. Pope Francis and every Catholic have to believe that Dogma Is absolute truth. If they will not say this then they may have fallen into Modernism.
    That’s the first question I’d ask of any priest, Bishop, Cardinal, or Holy Father. Is Dogma an absolute truth?

    October 3, 2013 at 6:08 pm
  • Josephine

    Obama is a Pope Francis fan so that speaks for itself, IMHO

    October 3, 2013 at 7:18 pm
  • Nolite Timere

    Ed dearest

    I do love a good three courser, in rebuttal of your starter I stand by my original post, now I am sure you are ‘clued up’ on Sacred Scripture, perhaps you should re read the Gospels. On many occasions the Pharisees and ‘good people’ criticised Our Lord for eating and spending time with ‘sinners’….exactly what Pope Francis has been doing.

    I wouldn’t say that I have no problems in some of the reports of what the Pope has been saying, however part of me is still fairly sceptical, the story above is based on a hearsay report of what someone wants us to think the Pope has said. In a similar way the reported interviews given recently are losing some meaning in translation.

    October 3, 2013 at 8:23 pm
    • editor

      Nolite Timere,

      Be sceptical no more. The answer to those who blame “translations” is to be found here.

      Here’s an extract:

      The Catholic world has been shaken by the recent interview with Pope Francis appearing in the Jesuit journal, La Civiltà Cattolica [Italian for Catholic Civilization, it is a periodical published since 1850 without interruptions by the Jesuits in Rome. It is among the oldest of Catholic Italian periodicals and is directly revised by the Secretariat of State of the Holy See before being published.]

      October 3, 2013 at 8:39 pm
  • Nolite Timere


    Yes the original (italian) is revised by the Holy See. However many of the stories we are seeing are media translations of the Italian, sometimes these are not very accurate!

    October 3, 2013 at 10:14 pm
    • editor

      If you recall, Nolite Timere, a reader from England, fluent in Italian, emailed me to say that what has been reported (with one exception which is neither here nor there) is accurate.

      The only Catholics I know who can take this pope in their stride, are those who are familiar with the prophecies of Our Lady at Quito,(17th century) Fatima (1917) and Akita (1973).

      And the reason is, they recognise, in what is unfolding before our eyes, the fulfilment of these prophecies, such as Quito (17th century) when Our Lady warned that in the 20th century marriage would be attacked and customs (morals) would be corrupted, saying that “the one who should speak out will fall silent”. Now, those of us familiar with that apparition and precise prediction, recognise what is going on when they hear the pontiff actually announce to the world that he is going to fall silent about marriage and morals – lest the world think we’re obsessed with these issues! That makes it a little easier to hang on to our Faith. And it makes a heck of a lot more sense than pretending that the pontiff is either not saying anything new, or is being misquoted by the media. Won’t wash.

      Check out the above named prophecies and then, think, Nolite Timere, think, think, think. And when you’ve done that, think again!

      October 3, 2013 at 10:33 pm
    • Lily

      This article is very telling indeed. There are a few very interesting quotes including one near the end which shows how Pope Francis has not been slow to criticise his two immediate predecessors, in a rather underhand way, IMHO.

      He is obviously a liberal pope, there isn’t any doubt about it in my mind.

      October 4, 2013 at 12:29 am
  • Christina

    Having been insulated (computerless) for some time, I have spent the last hour updating myself (via this thread) on what Pope Francis has been doing and saying in the last few weeks. Having gone through shock, horror, disbelief, and any number of other emotions, I was reminded again of the various prophecies about the end times (discussed previously on this blog). ‘Peter the Roman’ seems to fit well enough with Pope Francis’s view of his office. It isn’t too difficult to believe, given his truly uncatholic sayings and doings, that he is preparing the way for the Antichrist, and fast!

    Holy Michael, Archangel, defend us in the day of battle………

    October 4, 2013 at 1:19 pm
    • editor

      Welcome back, Christina!

      A reader in Glasgow emailed me the following extract from an article about a biography written by Paul Valley of Pope Francis – absolutely unbelievable: the email reads –

      Having read a tiny summary of the book, Untying the Knots, would you believe Pope Francis was so traditional! The biographer said,Bergoglio “came in as a conservative figure who hammered liberation theology, stopped them working in the slums, changed the liturgy back to pre-Vatican !!, reordered the churches back to the old way, reintroduced the old vestments and banned all progressive theology” he actually exacerbated the split between the left and the right in the Jesuits there, his biographer (Paul Valley) said.

      After some time in key leadership in Argentina, Bergoglio was deemed too divisive by his superiors in Rome and according to Valley caused such a stir he was eventually moved to Cordoba, (this was a place of humility and humiliation for the future Pontiff outside Buenos Aires because he was meddling all the time.)

      Pope Francis Untying the Knots apparently pieces the jigsaw of that incredible transformation! END.

      Well? Is the above unbelievable or what? Has “Rome” itself turned Cardinal Bergoglio/Pope Francis from being a “traditionalist” into a modernist?

      October 4, 2013 at 5:12 pm
      • 3littleshepherds


        How crazy were the liberal Jesuits at that time? Maybe he told them to wear vestments, say the NO mass, and to pray? hehe

        October 4, 2013 at 5:53 pm
  • scottish priest

    The Mass is more about leading others into the mystery of sacrifice, silence and ritual rather than the dialogue of sentimentality where the priest is at the centre rather than Christ. As priests we need to remember that the sacrifice of cavalry is perpetuated in and through us but is never about us. This us why in the old rite the priest not so much hadhis back to the people, rather everyone faces the same way .. This teaches us that active participation is what The liturgy allows us to be part of rather than something we do

    October 4, 2013 at 3:56 pm
  • scottish priest

    apologies not sure how that happened, that was part of an email I was writing that I somehow managed to post her..weird

    October 4, 2013 at 3:57 pm
  • Leo

    “Proselytism is solemn nonsense, it makes no sense. We need to get to know each other, listen to each other and improve our knowledge of the world around us. Sometimes after a meeting I want to arrange another one because new ideas are born and I discover new needs. This is important: to people, listen, expand the circle of get to know ideas. The world is crisscrossed by roads that come closer together and move apart, but the important thing is that they lead towards the Good.”


    “And I repeat it here. Everyone has his own idea of good and evil and must choose to follow the good and fight evil as he conceives them. That would be enough to make the world a better place.”

    – Pope Francis in La Repubblica interview with atheist Eugenio Scalfari

    As we have just celebrated the feast of Saint Francis of Assisi, it is worth considering the words and actions of the great missionary, and even drawing some comparisons. Can anyone imagine the zealous saint ever speaking similar words to those words of Pope Francis? Not me.

    On his third attempt, during the Fifth Crusade in 1219, Saint Francis reached the Middle East with the intention of proselytising the Moslems of the region. I’m sure many here are familiar with the story of the Saint, accompanied by Brother Illuminato, crossing the lines to preach to the Moslems led by Sultan al Malik al Kamil, who had previously promised a gold piece to anyone who brought him the head of a Christian.

    Having been beaten up and put in chains by their captors, when Saint Francis was eventually brought before the Sultan he boldly stated that he had been sent by the Most High God to point out to him the way of salvation and preach the one saviour of all, Our Lord Jesus Christ. The Sultan was informed that “if you do not wish to believe, we will commend your soul to God, because we declare that if you die while holding to your law, you will be lost; God will not accept your soul. For this reason we have come to you.”

    Saint Francis boldly told the Sultan that “if you wish to be converted to Christ along with your people, I will most gladly stay with you for love of Him. But if you hesitate to abandon the law of Mahomet for the faith of Christ, then command an enormous fire to be lit and I will walk into the fire along with your imams so that you will recognise which faith deserves to be held as the holier and more certain.”

    Not surprisingly, the same imams were not so keen on the challenge, having earlier insisted that the two missionaries be killed.

    The saint even offered to enter the fire alone, stating that if he was harmed it was due to his sins alone, but if he emerged unscathed, the Sultan and all his court must agree to convert. This proved too much of a challenge for the Sultan, who feared that “my people would stone me”.

    So that’s what the Old Evangelisation i.e. proselytizing was like. I don’t expect it would be widely approved of in these days of modernist “diabolical disorientation”.

    Saint Francis of Assisi had no problem with the concept of the Church Militant, in every sense of the word. He was no PC ideologue. He accepted the Crusade as both legitimate and ordained by God. At one time he remarked to his Friars that “…paladins and valiant knights who were mighty in battle pursued the infidels even to death” and “these holy martyrs died fighting for the Faith of Christ” (Legend of Perugia pp 1048-1049).

    He also left the Sultan in no doubt. How’s this for a bit of straight talking:

    “…it is just that Christians invade the land you inhabit, for you blaspheme the name of Christ and alienate everyone you can from His worship.” (Nova Vita di San Francesco, Arnaldo Fortini, p. 552)

    Not very spirit of Vatican II, that. Obviously dialogue, Dignitatis Humanae, and Nostra Aetate weren’t part of the programme. And most certainly, the spirit of Assisi meant something very different in the 13th century.

    What was Pope Francis saying about solemn nonsense?

    October 5, 2013 at 12:24 am
    • editor

      Leo – Brilliant. Many thanks.

      However, the facts which you have published above about St Francis, won’t stop the papolatrists insisting that Pope Francis is a model of his patron, St Francis of Assisi. There are none so blind as those who cannot (or will not) see…

      October 5, 2013 at 10:10 am
  • John Skacklefree

    I think it may have significance for the Fatima message (especially of a Pope being killed) that the Pope is planning to go to Jerusalem next year. By that time with Obama in the White House with his Muslim Brotherhood cronies who knows what the state of the world will be in a years time. Events are moving incredibly quickly at the moment and the slaughter of Christians under Islam and communism is proceeding ferociously. They think they are approaching the time when all the world will be under the thrall of the religion of death and we know that their intentions for Israel is to finish off what Hitler failed to accomplish. In that scenario a city strewn with dead bodies might not be so far fetched. There is even persecution under the Buddhists in Sri Lanka and under the Hindus in India. The martyrdom going on today is staggering. How long O Lord must you delay to rescue your faithful. Only your hand can stop it now – the homosexuals, Muslims, secularists, communists and freemasons all have the Catholic Church in their sights now. They will never back off and consider that the demise of the One True Church is imminent.

    October 5, 2013 at 10:30 am
    • editor

      John Shacklefree,

      A very interesting post. I tend to think of the events of the Third Secret taking place in Rome but I could be wrong (bound to happen one day!)

      Certainly your “how long O Lord…” is echoing how most of us think and feel right now. Even those who are usually more papolatrist than Catholic are acknowledging that, with each and every utterance of Pope Francis, the crisis in the Church is worsening big time.

      It will be interesting to see what, if anything happens on 13th October. If there is no divine intervention on that day, hang on until 27th April (see new thread) and thereafter we can all meet at the Erskine Bridge!

      Seriously, God will act in His own good time, there is no doubt about it – indeed, it seems obvious that He is already acting in warning mode in the world, with one major disaster after another establishing that things are not “normal” on the planet earth and it’s not just down to the use of a few plastic carrier bags. The sudden intervention which most Fatima experts believe forms part of the Third Secret, however, cannot be far off.

      October 5, 2013 at 2:13 pm
  • catholicconvert1

    It’s high time people woke up and smelt the Kenco. Paul VI said the Conclave should assemble and elect a new Pope, if he, or any of his successors became ‘Non Compis Mentis’. Now, pardon me, but Pope Francis is (unacceptable term removed by editor). Can the SSPX elect Bishop Fellay as Pope? After all who is adhering truly to the Faith of the Fathers? Suppress the Jesuits.

    Also, is ‘Interior Locution’ normal?

    October 5, 2013 at 3:27 pm
    • Whistleblower


      Please tell me your latest post was tongue in cheek? Can the SSPX elect Bishop Fellay pope? Surely you are joking…..?

      October 6, 2013 at 5:14 pm
      • catholicconvert1

        Of course I’m joking. Isn’t it obvious?

        October 8, 2013 at 1:06 pm
      • Whistleblower

        Honestly? No!

        October 8, 2013 at 1:46 pm
    • 3littleshepherds

      Catholicconvert sure is guileless.
      “suppress the Jesuits”!! That sounds good to me. 🙂

      At least we all know what the Third Secret is. The worst part of it probably has something to do with the devil striking the Pope.

      October 6, 2013 at 5:34 pm
      • 3littleshepherds

        There was a devotion I once read about a long time ago. I believe the nun was named something like Mary Martha Chambon. Our Lord told her to offer the Holy Wounds for Pope Pius IX, to cover him with the Holy Wounds to protect him.
        Does any know any particulars about this devotion?

        October 6, 2013 at 5:42 pm
      • catholicconvert1

        The Jesuits have done serious damage to the Church. Do the names Rahner and De Chardin ring any bells. I’ve been reading up on these two whackos.

        October 8, 2013 at 1:08 pm
      • 3littleshepherds

        What did Teilhard de Chardin have in common with St. Ignatius of loyola? Nothing. St. Ignatius and St. Francis Xavier would have run him out of town.

        October 8, 2013 at 4:05 pm
    • Miles Immaculatae

      Can the SSPX elect Bishop Fellay as Pope?

      This is called ‘conclavism’. The most tragic example of conclavism I have heard of is the ‘Palmarian Catholic Church’. Since appointing its own Supreme Pontiff in 1975, it has wandered very far from anything resembling Catholicism.

      October 6, 2013 at 5:55 pm
      • catholicconvert1

        Would the SSPX stray like the PCC? I doubt it.

        October 8, 2013 at 1:08 pm
    • Miles Immaculatae

      Authentic interior locutions are rare. Hallucination is fairly common.

      If you think you are having them, I would seriously advise that you make an appointment with your GP and explain to him/her some of the things which have been happening.

      October 6, 2013 at 6:01 pm
      • catholicconvert1

        No I have not had them. I know a Polish lady who did. She was, I think saying the prayers to St. Bridget of Sweden, and she saw a hand holding up a glowing golden cross in clouds etc.

        October 8, 2013 at 7:51 pm
      • Petrus


        Was she drunk?

        October 8, 2013 at 8:45 pm
      • 3littleshepherds

        I think the first thing to do is to find a natural explanation like the lady was just meditating and it was her imagination. If it kept happening she needs to tell a priest and not just assume it’s from God.
        We had a priest who told us in his sermon that none of us were allowed to have visions without his permission! Funny! But prudent.

        October 8, 2013 at 9:54 pm
      • Jonny Lemon

        It could well be authentic, she might have received a signal grace. Who am I to judge? All I know is that when various saints experienced paranormal phenomena they were very careful to discern whether it was natural (e.g. drunkenness) or preternatural (demonic), before they even considered supernaturality (from heaven). We should do the same.

        When I was younger, and more foolish, whilst under the influence of a certain substance – and I am not proud of this – I caught my friend in the corner of my periphery, and I thought his head had shrivelled into a kind of old, wrinkly stump. I was too terrified to look at him properly, I sat for for about 30 minutes trying to figure out what had happened to his head. Eventually he turned to speak to me and his head was normal, so I am all to familiar with how the human mind is able to play tricks on our perception.

        October 8, 2013 at 10:01 pm
    • Magdalene


      You state: “Pope Francis is nuts” – how offensive. Please show some respect.

      October 6, 2013 at 10:48 pm
      • editor


        Thank you for highlighting that remark – it had passed me by but is now deleted.

        Catholic Convert,

        in our About Us section it states clearly that nothing “personally nasty” should be posted. That includes calling anyone “nuts” – except in a jovial sense. As we all know Petrus is nuts and Theresa Rose is nuts, but unless we mean the term in the most affectionate sense (!) it’s not allowed. Please be very careful from this moment on as the song goes.

        October 6, 2013 at 11:14 pm
      • catholicconvert1


        It may have escaped your notice, but has the Pope not been spouting rubbish of late? I don’t need to repeat what has been said a thousand times before, but just read the previous blog posts. Those comments he made could be construed, in my view as nuts.

        October 8, 2013 at 1:10 pm
  • 3littleshepherds

    I think that religious liberty, ecumenism, and collegiality have been used to attack Our Lord’s Messianic Dignity, Our Lord as Priest, Prophet, and King – The Way, the Truth, the Life.
    I think the consecration of Russia was ordered by Our Lord as a public act of reparation, a threefold act of reparation to be made by the Pope and Bishops.
    1. Consecrate Russia for it’s conversion to the Catholic Faith
    2. Consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart
    3. Order the Bishops to do this

    Mr. Verrecchio wrote the following on his blog.

    “Jesus identified Himself as the way, the truth and the life.

    In the space of just a relative handful of words, Pope Francis has defined “the way” as a matter of brotherly love; “the truth” as whatever one thinks is good, and “the life” after which we seek as a goal for the here and now.

    In other words, Pope Francis has redefined Jesus Christ in terms that are perfectly acceptable to secular Jews, heathens and atheists; i.e., those who plainly reject Him and therefore He who sent Him.

    October 6, 2013 at 2:01 am
  • editor

    I’ve just received the latest (scandalous) news about Pope Francis from a reader in England (a non-Catholic pro-lifer). Click here to read more

    It’s truly increasingly difficult to find words to express one’s thoughts. One is well and truly incredulous. One has just heard a friend say: “he must know what he is doing” (by appointing this woman) to which one replied: “of course he does.” One’s friend added that at a time when we have impurity and pornography rife, we are “drowning in it” she points out, the last thing we need is the pope appointing a woman who thinks nothing of posing for topless photos with a “boyfriend” (husband eat your heart out) to a post in the Vatican.

    Could things get much worse? You betcha!

    October 6, 2013 at 2:48 pm
  • Wendy walker

    I am so sad ..I have been doing PRO LIFE work for 43 years ………..I am not a Catholic but deeply admire the Church and its magnificent teachings on so called contraception and Abortion…..I have met and been very humbly honoured to meet some marvellous Holy Priests ..dear Fr [Canon]Morrow and Fr P Marx more Saintly Souls you could not find …The Church was always a refuge from the modern way of life ..in the battle for LIFE ..but what has happened ?….I am seriously wondering if Pope Francis is suffering from Dementia ?…Surely no Pope in their stable right mind would dare t o say the things he does and His Ponificate has only just begun!!!!How alarming that Obama finds him admirable that really says it all…and Homosexual and liberalist Loony Lefties do too…its very ,very disturbing and can their be any good outcome to all this ?..One wonders if he needs an Exorcist and I am not saying that without meaning it I feel anyone who feels strongly enough must storm The Vatican with their concerns and complaints …this behaviour must be reigned in, it is as if The Catholic Faith is a beautiful knitted garment and he is unravelling it …What next

    October 6, 2013 at 4:33 pm
    • Lily

      Wendy Walker,

      What a beautiful comment from you but how sad that you are being so scandalised, as are many other non-Catholics. At least you have had the privilege of meeting good priests like Fr Marx, so you can see the difference.
      Pope Francis is a huge cause of scandal. I hope he doesn’t put you off becoming a Catholic. We’ve had bad popes before, but the Church is still the Mystical Body of Christ, and the means of salvation for all, so please don’t let this pope’s terrible behaviour put you off.

      October 6, 2013 at 7:48 pm
    • catholicconvert1

      Definitely dementa.

      October 8, 2013 at 1:11 pm
      • catholicconvert1

        Should say Dementia, didn’t press the key hard enough.

        October 8, 2013 at 1:12 pm
  • Wendy walker

    May I just say on a totally different point that at present 40 DAYS FOR LIFE is taking place around the World including the UK..Here peaceful,prayerful Christians pray ,and connect with people passing by Abortion Mills …as well as saving PRECIOUS PREBORN LIVES ,..they also start to heal those who have suffered from Abortion….Will you pray for the success of 40 DAYS please ?…If you want to know more please Google 40 DAYS FOR LIFE thank you …maybe you would consider helping to start a40 DAYS FOR LIFE near you in the future …thank you

    October 7, 2013 at 8:52 am
    • editor

      Thank you for that, Wendy. We all pray for your wonderful work and we have many active pro-lifers among our readership. I’m sure those who can be present will be supporting the 40Days for life event.

      October 7, 2013 at 9:00 am
  • Pat McKay

    For 50 years or more we’ve heard people say that the Church ‘needs to move with the times’. I should think many of us have even heard this from immediate family members – you know, those divorced, co-habiting, contracepting, ‘women’s right to choose’ – upholding, socialist, gay-friendly, Celtic-supporting ‘Catholics’ who regard Sunday/Holy Day Mass attendance and receiving the Sacraments as ‘optional extras’…

    Under Francis I, it would appear they are about to have their wish – and with frightening pace.

    How sad this is. To think of the decades of ridicule, scorn, abuse (and in some cases, even martyrdom) we have been subjected to for defending Holy Mother Church’s teachings on pro-life and moral issues, now suddenly everything is being turned on its head. We are no longer to be ‘hung up’ about these issues.

    I can see it all now. Re-‘marriage’ in Church, with Nuptial Mass, same-sex ‘marriage’ will be approved, sins of the flesh will no longer be ‘sins’, on-line ‘Confession’ (although nobody will really need this, except the ‘intolerant’), women priests/women bishops, married or co-habiting clergy (same-sex or otherwise), the Holy Rosary and Holy Days will be scrapped. Hooray, at last we’re ‘civilised’!

    October 7, 2013 at 10:38 am
    • Lily

      Pat McKay,

      “How sad this is. To think of the decades of ridicule, scorn, abuse (and in some cases, even martyrdom) we have been subjected to for defending Holy Mother Church’s teachings on pro-life and moral issues, now suddenly everything is being turned on its head. We are no longer to be ‘hung up’ about these issues.”

      I agree, it is very shocking indeed. Goodness knows what this pope is thinking of.

      I can’t believe that the things you describe will happen though because God won’t allow it, still, we’re in a very bad place right now with no end in sight.

      October 7, 2013 at 2:20 pm
  • Wendy walker

    what a masterpiece from our Pat Mckay as ever….. he has it in a nutshell…Priests , Bishops ,Canons Laity ,please LISTEN…the “clock” seems to be approaching midnight !

    October 7, 2013 at 11:54 am
  • catholicconvert1

    Pat McKay,

    Despite Pope Francis being completely of the wall, he won’t allow that. These beliefs were not created by the Popes, they are ordained of God and therefore no Pope can alter them. If I were you, I would stop worrying. It was all mentioned by Our Lady. It’s God’s Will.

    October 8, 2013 at 1:04 pm

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