Vatican Event: Why Would Pope Francis Permit Protestant Heresy To Be Sung?

Vatican Event: Why Would Pope Francis Permit Protestant Heresy To Be Sung?

I found these videos on the website of The Remnant earlier today.  In the above video, Michael Voris of Church Militant TV rightly exposes the fact that the popular “Amazing Grace” should not be sung in Catholic churches as routinely happens these days, but now he faces a dilemma since it’s been sung within the Vatican walls – in the presence of Pope Francis himself: he who, according to Mr Voris, is above and beyond all criticism.  Watch the performance below – and weep to see princes of the Church behaving like Pentecostal Protestants and a pope apparently moved to tears by a  Protestant “hymn” packed with heresy.  And – as a side issue, because who, really, gives a toss – ask yourself what it will take to get Michael Voris to waken up and admit that the problem within the Church today – the problem – is Papa Francis.

I have to admit that I’ve never liked “Amazing Grace” –  tuneless, heretical  and singularly uninspiring. Why any priest would choose it over the many beautiful traditional Catholic hymns available, beats me. If you can think of a reason, spill. Ditto if you can think of a reason why the Pope (any pope) would permit Protestant heresy to be said, read or sung, in his presence, with his approval, and the obvious approval of the swaying, with-it/cool cardinals within the Vatican walls.

Or perhaps you are one of those who sang along innocently, not realising that it is a Protestant song containing heresy? I’ve met people in that category and I couldn’t even swear on oath that I’ve never sung it myself in years gone by, although I can definitely swear, hand on heart and a stack of bibles, that I’ve never liked it.  There is so much confusion in the Church today and so little sound teaching in pulpits and schools, that there are undoubtedly innocent members of congregations who will have joined in the singing, without realising that they were “praising God” with heresy.  And now we’ll even find some who will say “Well, if it’s good enough for the Pope, it’s good enough for me” (with the sub-text, “and it should be good enough for God!”)

Truly, you couldn’t make it up. Anyway, read the Remnant article on the subject here and then share your thoughts (politely!)

Comments (102)

  • editor

    Cilla Black’s having Amazing Grace sung at her funeral today – programme here

    August 20, 2015 at 9:13 am
  • morgana

    There’s not one Catholic hymn on that order of service and one of her own songs at holy communion quite outrageous

    August 20, 2015 at 9:45 am
    • Eileenanne

      It’s horrific, and the worst thing is that it makes some ordinary Catholics think that’s how to conduct a funeral, and God help any priest who tries to stick to a correct funeral liturgy. It is exactly like an Eastenders funeral, with the participation of a few more boastfully practising homosexuals than are usually found in Albert Square – unless it has changed since I stopped watching.
      I’m away to write my protest to the bishop. Hope others will too.

      August 20, 2015 at 9:54 am
      • Athanasius

        Eileenanne

        Don’t waste your time writing to “Bishop Tom,” he no longer has the Catholic Faith. As for those priests you refer to who would get stick for trying to conduct a proper Catholic funeral, they are fairly thin on the ground, if they exist at all. I have been to numerous Novus Ordo funerals, or rather “celebrations of the lives of,” not one of which remotely resembled a Traditional requiem Mass.

        And so it will contuinue until the Catholic faithful rid themselves of their false fear of disobedience (what a joke), stop attending the Novus Ordo and get back to practicing the Faith of our Fathers. This is the only strong message to send out to our wayward Pope, bishops and priests. Vote with the feet, find a Traditional Mass.

        August 20, 2015 at 10:35 am
      • editor

        Athanasius,

        I don’t think it’s a waste of time to write to the Bishop any more than it was a waste time for us to write to the priests in St Mungo’s recently for their nasty attack on the TLM. It’s precisely because they never receive any complaints that these bishops think they’re going a great job. And, of course, the spiritual gains from the effort involved, mean, waste of time or not, it’s not a waste of grace, if you get my drift! That doesn’t negate the advice in your final paragraph – that’s a given. But we must do both. Speak out, be the prophetic voice in our own little corner, and vote with our feet.

        I’m going to email him, briefly. Short, and anything but sweet.

        Signed…

        Sister Mary of the Ever-Burning Lamp…

        August 20, 2015 at 10:48 am
      • editor

        “God help any priest who tries to stick to a correct funeral liturgy.”

        Too true. When the Bishops of Ireland tried to put an end to this sort of thing at funerals and weddings, they met with outright rebellion. The people just won’t accept the rules. It is, as you say, horrific.

        August 20, 2015 at 10:44 am
  • leprechaun

    Madame Editor,

    From my Baptist/Methodist infancy I remember hymns like Jesus wants me for a sunbeam and You in your small corner, and me in mine.

    From my 40 years in the Novus Ordo wilderness I encountered many renditions of Sideways Christian Soldiers and Khumbyah and many imports from the Taize Community.

    Since returning to Tradition I relish Bring Flowers of the rarest and all those wonderful hymns to the Blessed Virgin Mary too numerous to mention.

    As for the ditties rolled out at marriages and funerals these days, I can but paraphrase: “As ye sing so shall ye believe” – does the adjective “shallowness” come to mind?

    August 20, 2015 at 10:04 am
    • editor

      Leprechaun,

      Yes, “shallowness” does come to mind, when considering most, if not all, of the contemporary hymns. Like you, I love Brings Flowers of the rarest and the other beautiful hymns to Our Lady. They really do reach the parts (of the soul) that the contemporary songs sung in churches do not reach…

      August 20, 2015 at 10:39 am
  • LindainPA

    As a convert, I am not as disturbed by this as others seem to be. It was an ecumenical event. I, personally, like this hymn and the story behind it.

    As a church musician, I would not play this at a Sunday Mass, though it is often requested at funerals and is in our missalette. People leading the music are to encourage participation by those attending. At an ecumenical event, it seems only fitting to choose hymns that are known by both Catholics and Protestants. I probably would have chosen something like ‘How Great Thou Art’, or “Love Divine, All Loves Excelling’.

    There are other hymns in our missalette that are not theologically sound as well. I refuse to sing them. ‘Look Beyond’ includes the line “Moses brought us manna from the sky” and was suggested on Aug. 2 when the Gospel reads, “It was NOT Moses who gave the bread from Heaven…”

    I emailed this concern to OCP…

    “As it is written, I would not choose to sing ‘There is Nothing Told’ because of the word “engaged” in the first verse. Mary and Joseph were betrothed. According to scripture and Jewish custom, they were married, although they lived apart. Why not just use the word “betrothed?” It is theologically correct and works musically.”

    This was the response…

    <>

    I am more disturbed when I find ‘Catholic’ hymns where the theology seems flawed.

    Using hymns that are considered strictly Catholic, that may have been unfamiliar to many gathered at this ecumenical event, would have appeared to be deliberately exclusive. There are good Christian hymns that are familiar to most. And, we are indeed saved by God’s grace. I don’t believe this hymn was intended as a response to the debate on faith and works. Had they chosen the hymn ‘Grace Alone’, you certainly would have a point.

    August 20, 2015 at 12:51 pm
    • editor

      LindainPA

      I’m glad you corrected that terribly common error about Our Lady and St Joseph being “engaged” when they were technically married – well done for that.

      However, prayers (and hymns are prayers put to music) are for the purpose of addressing and worshipping God. It really is too bad if anybody else feels “excluded”. Choosing prayers and hymns to suit Protestants, means that we are essentially sayjing to God, “Listen, I’m going to talk to you in a most inappropriate way, I’m going to worship you by spouting heresy and even blasphemy, because that beats making our Protestant friends feel “excluded”. Hope you understand, Lord, but if not, too bad.”

      C’mon. We need to get things the right way round. The ecumenical movement is diabolical and thus things are ALWAYS the wrong way round when we take that manner of confused and wrong thinking, as our starting point. We start from the point where we choose prayers and hymns that will please God. Everything else gets tossed. Those who feel excluded only need to approach for instruction!

      August 20, 2015 at 3:27 pm
  • LindainPA

    For some reason, the OCP response didn’t print…

    “This text is a translation (from French) done by the noted Australian Jesuit theology professor and composer, Father Christopher Willcock.”

    Incorrect is still incorrect.

    August 20, 2015 at 12:56 pm
  • morgana

    If your choosing a catholic church for a funeral them common sense surely dictates that you will expect to hear catholic hymns appropriate for the occasion irrespective of whether the congregation is mixed.I wouldn’t expect to go into a protestant church and hear catholic hymns despite myself being in the minority and whats more I don’t think they would make any allowance .

    August 20, 2015 at 1:28 pm
    • LindainPA

      Our priest allows music that comes from our missalette – that can be posted. ‘Amazing Grace’ is there. I have noticed that the wording has been changed in some of the hymns that have been deemed ‘Protestant’ (that I grew up with) when they are included in the missalette.

      I find NO justification for using the Beatles’ ‘Long and Winding Road’!!!

      August 20, 2015 at 3:29 pm
      • cbucket

        They should have played another of Cilla hits. “Surprise, Surprise” (when the reality of eternity hits you between the eyes).

        August 20, 2015 at 4:47 pm
      • Margaret Mary

        CBucket,

        LOL! That’s absolutely hilarious! God forgive me, I laughed heartily at that! I should say, in charity, that I hope it’s not the case but the idea of it really made me laugh heartily.

        God rest her soul, may she rest in peace.

        August 20, 2015 at 9:12 pm
      • Margaret Mary

        LindainPA,

        I completely agree about “Long and Winding Road” – I couldn’t believe that they finished the Mass with that and the bishop saying it was most appropriate. The only Catholic way to interpret that is that she’s going to spend a long time in Purgatory, because she’s not had a long life – 72 is not long these days.

        August 20, 2015 at 9:15 pm
  • catholicconvert1

    I must confess that I was totally ignorant of the nature of this Protestant hymn, and after watching Fr. John Hardon’s commentary (see here- http://remnantnewspaper.com/web/index.php/fetzen-fliegen/item/1919-less-than-amazing-grace-inside-the-vatican) it is now clear that this hymn is by and large Calvinist theology in a nutshell, especially regarding one of the five points of Calvinism, Irresistible Grace, which denies that humans have no free will as a consequence of Calvin’s extreme interpretation of Original Sin, Total Depravity. Irresistible Grace says that we are born as complete slaves to sin and unless God chooses to bestow His Irresistible Grace upon us we cannot choose to follow God, refrain from Evil and achieve Salvation. I believe this is Monergism.

    However, Catholicism teaches that we have free will and we can, and indeed must, co-operate with God’s grace, whether it be Actual, Sanctifying and Sacramental, but needless to say, we still have the freedom to reject it.

    To me, Calvinism nearly goes to the length of denying the soul, or at least an integral part of that, because the soul is like God in the sense that it is a spirit and will never die, has understand and free will, as said in the Baltimore Catechism. Calvinism reduces us to the state of animals, and denies we have understanding, i.e. the ability to regulate our actions, by responding to the graces which God gives us.

    This hymn also denies that saving grace is found in the sacraments, and denies the efficacy of good works in the economy of salvation, as taught by St. James and by Christ our Saviour in the Parable of the Sheep and Goats.

    I never gave any though to this hymn, but now I know I’ll say silent if this hymn is sung in Mass.

    August 20, 2015 at 1:42 pm
  • catholicconvert1

    Oops, sorry I forgot to answer the question. Why would Pope Francis permit Protestant heresy to be sung? Er…because he’s a Protestant…with bells on!! I think I’m nearly right. Oh yes, that’s it- he’s not only a Protestant, he’s a liberal Protestant, one that would not look out of place in the Church of England.

    The world is so diabolically disoriented that we may soon witness Lutherans belting out Pange Lingua, or Free Presbyterians warbling to ‘Full in the Panting Heart of Rome’.

    Amazing Grace, as performed above, and those nu-Catholics with their Pentecostal-style outstretched arms, is a physical embodiment of the Novus Ordo Church, with traditional Priests and Bishops (+Burke, +Cordileone et al) existing, along with the TLM, as a mere footnote. I tell you, if I was converting on liturgy alone, I would have joined the Orthodox, no doubt about it. It was ‘everything else’ and not the liturgy that brought be to Rome.

    August 20, 2015 at 2:00 pm
  • editor

    Below, you can view the Requiem Mass for Cilla Black – I’ve just watched it live and, from the state of the art vestments to the jokes to the closing song, I just kept thanking God that my own beloved mother had the real thing – a traditional Latin Requiem Mass, complete with black vestments*, altar boys, the lot, in a silent church, with all the prayers offered for her soul and salvation. Not a pop song or joke within earshot. (*It was interesting to see how the majority of those attending wore dark clothes, the men in black ties. Seems even the lapsed and the unbelievers have more sense of funeral occasion that the priests and bishop.)

    But THAT debacle? I just could not stand it. Yet the celebrities interviewed outside thought it “beautiful” – a fun day all round.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVog-qLelA4

    Poor Cilla. May she rest in peace…

    August 20, 2015 at 3:18 pm
    • Eileenanne

      I haven’t watched it all, but enough for me to see that it was even worse than the Order of Service led me to expect.
      Truly awful.

      August 20, 2015 at 10:12 pm
  • crofterlady August 20, 2015 at 3:34 pm
  • Athanasius

    God forbid that my remains ever end up at the mercy of circus clergy like that. What a disgraceful spectacle for a Catholic funeral, absolutely no solemnity or reverence whatsoever. This ‘celebration of life’ nonsense that has usurped the Catholic Requiem Mass is just pure emotional humanism. Dear God, how much longer will we have to put up with this mockery of our holy religion?

    May Our Lord have mercy on the soul of Cilla Black.

    August 20, 2015 at 11:08 pm
    • editor

      Well said, Athanasius. In the proverbial nutshell. Well said.

      August 20, 2015 at 11:30 pm
  • morgana

    What makes the mockery worse in my opinion was the fact nearly all the clergy were older men who most certainly know better.

    August 21, 2015 at 12:09 am
    • Athanasius

      Morgana

      Yes, it is the older generation Catholics who are the worst. At least the young don’t know any better

      August 21, 2015 at 12:44 am
  • editor

    Here’s a very good summary of why we’re seeing scandals like this Vatican event – with the decline of the Mass, the rise of Satan and evil… Listen closely…

    [youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyspI2ib_tg&w=560&h=315%5D

    August 21, 2015 at 11:06 am
    • Fidelis

      I listened closely – really clear explanation of the link between the attacks on the Mass and the rise of evil. Terrifying stuff, really.. The Highway to Hell song at the start really says it all – and as for the celebs wearing horns in the audience – unbelievable. I wonder how long it will be till that song is played at a Catholic funeral?

      August 21, 2015 at 12:42 pm
  • Pat McKay

    I wonder how many non-Catholics went up to receive Holy Communion at Cilla Black’s funeral Mass. Did anybody hear the Celebrant announce that this is forbidden?

    August 21, 2015 at 12:59 pm
    • editor

      The bishop did say that those who had the faith could receive Communion (words to that effect – “forbidden” isn’t a word any modern priest is likely to use) and that others could come up for a blessing. Some did go up for a blessing but in the absence of close-ups at that time, I couldn’t tell who was who, in that Who’s Who congregation!

      When you watch that debacle, however, Pat, and then watch the Michael Matt video with his explanation and visual clips of the TLM, does it make you want to weep – or what?

      August 21, 2015 at 1:56 pm
    • Margaret Mary

      Christopher Biggins, who is in a civil partnership with Neil Sinclair, received Holy Communion from the bishop and was given a pat on the arm by the bishop right after. That’s the only one I saw.

      August 26, 2015 at 11:14 am
  • morgana

    Surely a better choice of words would have been only those in a state of grace approach for Holy Communion but then again with the modernists it always comes back to not offending anybody – frankly who cares.

    August 21, 2015 at 11:54 pm
  • Pat McKay

    At my dear mother’s (+ R.I.P.) funeral Mass in 2007, I knew some of her non-Catholic neighbours would be there – also that they might go up to receive Holy Communion if nobody told them they shouldn’t. I made a point of seeing the priest before Mass and asking him to ‘intimate’ this from the pulpit. Although he nodded his head, purportedly in agreement, he never actually mentioned it! To this day, I don’t know whether any non-Catholics did receive Holy Communion on that occasion.

    But, as Morgana says, who cares? And as I’ve said before, at the forthcoming sin-nod all sorts of ‘out-dated, traditional taboos’ will probably be overturned, including this one. To deny Holy Communion to non-Catholics will be dismissed as ‘divisive’ and ‘non-pastoral’.

    August 22, 2015 at 12:47 pm
    • Fidelis

      Pat McKay

      If you watch the John Vennari video on the new thread “Voris Fighting the Wrong Battle” as I’ve just done, you will come to the conclusion I came to a while ago, that there’s no point attending the novus ordo – if possible, we should all vote with our feet and go to the old Mass. That priest nodding his head but not actually making any acknowledgment of what you’d said, is so insulting. It’s so lacking in respect. I’d definitely shake off the dust.

      August 22, 2015 at 3:13 pm
      • Pat McKay

        Surely priests must be aware that Nuptial Masses and funeral Masses are likely to be attended by some non-Catholics, as well as lapsed Catholics.

        They ought to make a point of intimating what the rules are on EVERY such occasion, without having to be asked. A former non-Catholic boss of mine once chatted away about how he….’took Communion at a Roman Catholic Service’….. His face fell when I told him he ‘shouldn’t do that’, he was completely unaware he was in error and wanted to know ‘why ever not?’.

        Incidentally, back in the 70s, the parish priest at this same church where my mother’s funeral Mass was held gave his sermon one time about non-Catholics who attended Mass there. He went on about how people of other denominations (and none) were ‘most welcome’ to come to Mass and that he ‘hoped they felt at home’ in his church…. His manner was almost apologetic however, when he said…’I have to point out that although you are welcome to come along here, you CANNOT receive Holy Communion’….The vibes I got from his tone were….’we wish it weren’t so, but we’re afraid that’s how it is’….and….’maybe things will change in the future’…

        Things did indeed change! Ever since ‘Communion in the hand’ became common practice, abuses of the Sacred Host have been legion.

        August 22, 2015 at 5:54 pm
  • catholicconvert1

    I do like some Protestant hymns, however, such as ‘Nearer My God To Thee’, ‘Immortal, Invisible’, ‘Abide With Me’ and ‘When I survey The Wondrous Cross’, which were written by a Unitarian, a Free Presbyterian, an Anglican and a Congregationalist, respectively. I was in York a couple of weeks ago with my parents, and when we were sat in the park next to the Minster, ‘Immortal, Invisible’ was played on the Minster bells, which was quite moving.

    August 24, 2015 at 8:03 pm
    • Helen

      CC, do you know that there is a weekly Sunday TLM at St. Wilfrid’s Parish Church right next to the Minster? It’s offered by the Oratorian Fathers who now run the parish.

      August 25, 2015 at 10:58 am
      • catholicconvert1

        Yes, I am aware of that, but I cannot afford it as I have just left University and presently unemployed. £19 is a lot to spend every week on train tickets! Money which I do not have for the time being. I did attend a Novus Ordo Mass celebrated by a visiting Franciscan Friar of the Renewal, which was three weeks ago on Wednesday.

        August 25, 2015 at 1:45 pm

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