Editor writes…
Can you add to the reasons given in the above video, to love the TLM?
And is it possible to – do you ever hear anyone – speak about having a “love” for the New Mass?
I’ve never heard anyone say that – ever.
However, you may have heard that and if so… let’s hear it, here (so to speak) !
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Comments (39)
Here’s an admission. When I converted to Catholicism back in 1985 I used to love going to Mass, because I knew what the Mass was and Who I was receiving in Holy Communion. I had had no experience of the TLM at all and didn’t even really know it still existed. However, I didn’t ‘love’ many aspects of the Novus Ordo which I now realise are abuses, and the process of becoming disatisfied with the Novus Ordo was, for me, gradual, but unstoppable. The funny thing is, the first time I was taken to a TLM I remember coming out thinking ‘that’s the last time I go to one of those’ ! I think it was a real culture shock as I was still in a Novus Ordo mindset and found the TLM very difficult to follow. And the Novus Ordo, for some odd reason, does build up a very strong mindset among its few adherents. However, I persevered and little by little grew to love the TLM and stopped going to the Novus Ordo many years ago. The behaviour of the congregation is always a huge give-away for me. Before and immediately after a N.O. Mass (and sometimes even during) it’s usually like a bingo hall, with people loudly talking and laughing and generally acting as though the Blessed Sacrament wasn’t there. At the TLM I attend, there is complete silence before, during and after Mass as people prepare quietly for Mass, hear Mass respectfully, and make their silent thanksgivings afterwards. By their fruits ye shall know them. It seems to me that many of the N.O. crowd treat Mass attendance as a social occasion, and little more.
Westminster Fly,
I appreciate your honesty and no-one will think any less of you for your “that’s the last time I go to one of those” because even Catholics raised in the TLM who have become used to the novus ordo say things like that, that they prefer the vernacular Mass and wouldn’t go back to the TLM – I’ve heard it myself. As a convert, your reaction is understandable. Here’s my admission. I kept going to the novus ordo even though friends were telling me I could go to the TLM, there was one not that far from where I lived at the time, this is going back a few years now, but although I knew the new Mass was deficient, I just kept attending because it would have taken more effort and more time to travel to the TLM. I feel ashamed of that now, and would not go back to the novus ordo for all the tea in China. In fact, I had to attend a funeral recently in a novus ordo and I might as well have been in a Salvation Army hall. I can’t believe I attended it for so many years because now – I hope this is not too shocking – I detest it.
What can I add to the reasons why I love the TLM – well, the sermons are different from the novus ordo, not “social justice” stuff but solid doctrine and sometimes lovely sermons about saints and devotions.
Just to say – I loved that video, it got so much information into a short space of time. I hope it encourages more people to try the TLM. There is one usually around somewhere, either the FSSP, ICK, SSPX, somewhere, within travelling distance, most of us can find one.
I don’t think anyone could seriously deny that the TLM is a far more beautiful liturgical experience than the novus ordo. The thing is that most Catholics are not looking for a beautiful liturgical experience they just watch to keep the Sunday obligation and get home asap. That’s the reality IMHO. Westminster is right to say it’s more of a social experience than a liturgical one.
Nicky,
That is 100% correct. The novus ordo has emptied the pews and the few who remain just want to be gone asap.
Listening to the video made me want to weep for all that we have lost. I loved the traditional Mass of my childhood and all the plainsong and beautiful hymns that we grew up with. Unfortunately I cannot get to a TLM now but am grateful that in our parish we have something of a hybrid: plainchant, traditional hymns, silence at times while our priest says some of the ancient Latin, respectful liturgy, no chat in church, occasional holy hours and benediction etc. so I do love going to Mass but would return to the traditional Mass in a heartbeat if it were possible.
Elizabeth,
I feel for you, as it’s not always easy or even possible to get to a traditional Mass. You mention missing the traditional hymns but it must depend on where you attend, because in the SSPX chapels they don’t seem to do traditional hymns. We hardly ever have one at the end of Mass when I go there, and never sing the traditional Communion hymns after Communion, such as O Bread of Heaven or O Godhead hid, which we regularly sang in my parish before the council. Occasionally they sing something at the end, but it is not the rule, just very occasionally. It makes the devotional side less enriching but I’ve only ever heard one other person saying the same thing so I tend to keep my opinion to myself.
I know the main thing is the Mass itself, grateful for that, but I just want everything back to the way it was before 1969, LOL! Even the missal was different then – I prefer the previous missal to the 62 one, and I’m mystified as to why the SSPX agreed to the 62, but it’s better than the novus ordo so I don’t say too much about that!
It’s good that your novus ordo has some of the old Mass in there – that is good and means your priest’s heart is in the right place. Maybe he’ll provide the traditional Mass at some point.
If you kept better company you would hear countless people say they love the New Mass
Kevin Cameron,
The most I’ve ever heard anyone say about the new Mass is that they prefer it because it’s in English and quick. They are not exactly Gospel greedy, LOL!
Kevin Cameron,
You have my condolences, since you love what is nothing more than a “banal, on the spot product,” as perfectly described by Pope Benedict XVI.
RCA Victor,
When I first saw Kevin’s comment I wanted to quote that piece of dynamite, but decided to wait until I had time to dig out the slightly longer context… Here it is…
In his preface to Monsignor Klaus Gamber’s book, The Reform of the Roman Liturgy – speaking of the changes that were made to the Mass – Cardinal Ratzinger (later Pope Benedict XVI) wrote:
“In the place of liturgy as the fruit of development came fabricated liturgy. We abandoned the organic, living process of growth and development over centuries, and replaced it—as in a manufacturing process—with a fabrication, a banal on-the-spot production. Gamber, with the vigilance of a true prophet and the courage of a true witness, opposed this falsification …”
And for the record, Kevin, Sugar Plum, you won’t find “better company” than Monsignor Klaus Gamber, a renowned liturgist…
Don’t worry about apologising. By the time you get all that egg off your (I’m sure lovely) face, I’ll be gone to catch up with my beauty sleep.
Say nothing, folks… Or else 😀
In reply to Kevin. Sir if you weren’t searching for Truth I dare say that you wouldn’t be on Here.
Do not make the Mistake of
Condemnation Prior to Investigation.
God Bless.
Kevin,
You should sue your English teacher – you know, the one who forgot to tell you that you don’t write daft sentences that have no context.
Spell out what you mean by “better company”… Better that what or who? And since “countless people” are not attending the New Mass, I don’t think we’ll find them saying they love the New Mass. They’d need to get themselves back into a church building first, if for no other reason that we need to count them…
Gerragrip.
Editor,
Survey time: how many bloggers think that people love the Novus Ordo because:
(a) They can get their Sunday obligation over with on Saturday night;
(b) They like to sing kum-bah-yah, socialize, and hold their hands up in the air during Mass;
(c) They understand that the Novus Ordo gives plenty of wiggle room for homosexuals and feminists;
(d) They like the idea of the Church being constantly “updated”;
(e) Their sins, so they are told by a Novus Ordo priests, are no big deal;
(f) It makes them feel very important and righteous to have such a major part to play in the liturgy;
(g) All of the above.
RCA Victor,
I vote (g) “all of the above” – and I have a feeling the rest of our bloggers would vote the same way (or else … kidding!)
Dear friends
I am in complete agreement with all your thoughts and observations regarding the TLM.
I do not think many people truly recognise, understand and appreciate the beauty, dignity, solemnity and the profound sense of the mystery of entering into the worship and presence of the Most Holy Trinity in the TLM.
It is such a beautiful and sublime experience that language does not truly do justice to adoring God in a manner which embodies and exemplifies our Catholic faith in all its richness and beauty.
Like each of you friends, l too feel heartbroken that so many of our fellow Catholics fail to comprehend and appreciate or would even contemplate allowing themselves to even attend the TLM and allow God to enter into their souls in such a profound and Grace filled manner.
Like each of you l continue to pray and hope that in the designs of Providence ‘ the Mass of all the ages’ will be restored to the life and centre of Catholic life.
Every blessing
Michael 🙏
Just speaking for myself, I think it is a mistake to focus on the beauty and solemnity of the TLM (obviously in a completely superior liturgical class than the hack job Novus Ordo) without first focusing on what it is and what is the source of all those admirable characteristics: a re-presentation of the Passion, Death and Resurrection of Our Lord.
“Do this in commemoration of me.”
The sublime beauties of the TLM flow from that central metaphysical, mystical, ineffable fact – Christ present on the altar – not the other way around.
RCA Victor,
I can’t see anyone disagreeing with that but in defence of the rest of us, I think it’s fair to say that we take that for granted when speaking of the beauty and solemnity of the TLM – that is the whole point, that it is that liturgy and not the novus ordo, which makes clear what the Mass is. I’m genuinely wondering what makes you think any of us see it as the other way round? Maybe you were just generalising so I’m just doing my due diligence research, LOL!
Josephine,
I wasn’t thinking of anyone here (at the risk of making Editor sad because I wasn’t thinking of her…) – I was referring to the lead video, whose reasons for loving the TLM struck me as rather superficial and inverted. Too much focus on accidentals and none on the real substance of it.
But I’m also curious as to why you fell you need to come to the defense of everyone….
That said, there is a potential weakness in my argument, since Novus Ordo apologists like Kevin Cameron above could claim that Christ is also present on the altar in the Novus Ordo, which therefore makes it just as beautiful as the TLM. To which I would reply: while it is true that Our Lord is present on a Novus Ordo altar (table?) (assuming that all conditions for validity are met), since the Novus Ordo is specifically designed to obscure the fact that Christ is present on the altar, that automatically makes it fatally flawed, and a fatally flawed liturgy can never be truly beautiful.
Unless, of course, one is into self-deception…
Josephine & RCA Victor,
As I was closing down to catch up on that much needed beauty sleep, I caught your exchange. My, my. Josephine moves right up the pay scale for coming to the defence of “the rest of us” – it may not be needed this time, but who knows what the future will bring, so you have moved into the six figure pay category, now, our Josephine… (£000.000 p.a.) 😀
RCA Victor, I’m a wee bit surprised at what you say about the video “whose reasons for loving the TLM struck me as rather superficial and inverted. Too much focus on accidentals and none on the real substance of it.”
Nay, nay. Thou misunderstandeth! The “real substance of it” is made crystal clear in the “accidentals”. Think about it, RCA Victor; think, think, think, and when you’ve done that, think again…
Here’s an example…
Someone might say that watching the priest and the servers genuflecting every time they cross in front of the Tabernacle is “beautiful” (I say it all the time) but I think it’s beautiful because of Who is contained, marvellously, in the Tabernacle, before which they genuflect.
When I mention to others that one of the things that marks out the TLM from the NO for me, is precisely the way the priest and servers never pass before the Tabernacle without genuflecting, I don’t add “because the Tabernacle contains the Real Presence of Our Lord” – I expect the numpties to know that, to understand that I wouldn’t be finding it “beautiful” but rather puzzling that they were genuflecting so often, unless they were doing so because of the “real substance” of the Mass.
Allow me to repeat, RCA Victor: Think, think, think. And when you’ve done that… think again! 😀
PS: since this is a one-off aberration on your part, and since you can’t help being American and not Scots, you will retain your six-figure annual pay award for the foreseeable future… this time 😀
Editor,
Thanks for the pay rise, LOL!
What I would really Love to see is Traditional Mass stopped and just Plain Mass stated. The reason I say this is that especially it seems in the U.S.A they have this ( to me ) saying of Trad in disrespect for The Latin Mass . Also for those of us who attend The Real Mass of Ages we know beyond doubt unfortunately that the N.O. is an uppity Protestant Service with a few people Shaking Hands near the End. Of course once Jimmy Martin gets His way ( and He will ) they’ll be a kissing and dancing in the Aisles . Of course in lots of Services under Cupich they’re already doing so.
Kevin . It’s good to see you visit Catholic Truth and it is Catholic Truth none of this Imagine Garbage . I know not if you watched the Video above but if you did why not come to The Mass of Ages with an open mind and Heart and then criticise it if you must until then take this at least on Board.
As a Catholic You must know that Catholic Priests have consecrated Hands for a Reason. It is one of the Major things that keeps Me going to The Catholic Mass and not the Revved up Protestant Service. IE there are no Women with Stiletto Heels prancing about and giving out The Eucharistic Sacrament . Am sorry but I cannot go back to that . Also and I as a Man don’t really want to see Young Women at Mass with attire more Suited for The Beach, on a Hot Day of course.
Josephine
I am in accord with your remarks. The central metaphysical and ontological reality and nature of the Mass is self evident, the beauty etc is a sublime expression and recapitulation of the Paschal Mystery in a most profound manner.
Every blessing
Michael 🙏
Send this today blog to Bishop Roche aka cockrache coined by the clergy. He’s a protege of St Gallen mafia group with cormac Murphy o Connor, Carlo Maria Martini, Godfried Danneels, Cormac Murphy-O’Connor, Achille Silvestrini, Lubomyr Husar, Walter Kasper and Karl Lehmann. Its hallmarks of bugini’s fingers all over.
Francis do You Honestly Believe that this would influence The Horrible Swish Dancing on Ice Arthur Roche.
He is well named Roche by name and Roche by Nature . He is also a Career Clergyman ,and Bergoglios Chief Hatchet Man .
I would also seriously doubt if Roche has ever been at a Latin Mass.
He is of Dead Wood and rather Him than Me on Judgement Day .
Faith of our fathers, I don’t believe for one sec that today blog would influence that Bishop aka ‘Cockroach’ coined by priests of his ex diocese. Yes he’s careerist cleric and also a protege of CMOC. Various rumours re him in ex diocese of Leeds.
I don’t think he ever experienced the supernatural., beyond the veil if you like. He hasn’t been consistent and capable of changing his positions. Few years ago, he supported TLM and now he’s virtually gung ho going against him. Video of his remarks proved it.
BTW, I wouldn’t trust him cos its bugini finger prints all over it. He’s yes man and angling for that RED hat. He don’t get on well with nichols of Westminster. List goes on etc.
Nuff said.
This article on The Remnant website, It’s the Mass that Matters, includes video of an interview with Bishop Schneider which I think fits well with this discussion.
https://remnantnewspaper.com/web/index.php/articles/item/5922-it-s-the-mass-that-matters-michael-matt-interviews-bishop-athanasius-schneider/
Josephine
Thank you for the link.
Friends in addendum l would like to recommend Bishop Schneider’s latest book entitled The Catholic Mass.
It is a beautiful exposition in terms of depth, content and insight.
Every blessing
Michael 🙏
I am delighted to see there is a discussion on this topic. I am reading up on the Mass at present to better inform myself . I am in the process of reading the book ‘The Incredible Catholic Mass by Fr. Cochem. This thread gives me the opportunity to highly recommend this book.
The introduction of the book states that “probably not 10% of adult lay Catholics know even 10% of what’s in this book”. It’s a facinating read, and I compel any Catholic to read this book. It will help you to understand the value of the Mass and increase your love for the Mass.
I have put the two links here: one is the old front cover and the second link is the new front cover. I have the old one which I prefer for some strange reason!
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/302509663724?epid=962761&_trkparms=ispr%3D1&hash=item466efb25ec:g:130AAOSwZlZZ-Z-D&amdata=enc%3AAQAGAAAA8GTH%2B5IfQTVBLdk11OevNxQcTHsAkBwoVMhvkHt8mIDASixmvUgv7kx%2FCyUA767FxA3CY0XWibnD74Qtwckvc46ygHpcbM4GmUOQIkH0IOqj0B2Q9EWcJLU9NmwfghNhY7%2F0KvUgkD9F8J5SozdR80asfiPnNZjdebbYpQwf1q1oawWq%2FjrRsutvxCI%2BtgcpWBkWyxEfaUgf3BNaZQ5wJ03XIFnJATTX0DPqIs1zIS2tkio7NQU4tgRurAkIvvrr3cQYt46PWSrBoGXlOxPNmHMI0jFxspXHOTOTWTPmJipr8fpjhuKEiI7GYb2WbsusSQ%3D%3D%7Ctkp%3ABFBMiv7v7oFg
https://www.abebooks.co.uk/servlet/SearchResults?sts=t&cm_sp=SearchF-_-home-_-Results&tn=the%20incredible%20mass&an=Fr.%20Cochem
Catherine,
I will buy that book – sounds marvellous.
Westminsterfly,
I fully agree with you. I would never go back to the novus ordo. I started going to the SSPX TLM over 16 years ago. I had never heard of an alternative Mass, I hadn’t a clue, I just know things were not right.I was always taught to have respect and quiet at Mass, and things did not seem the same as when I was growing up. I am very happy to have found the TLM because I have since been educating myself on the Faith. Once I was at the SSPX a few months, I thought “I need to read up on the SSPX and learn more about the difference, so the first two things was the book “An Open Letter to Confused Catholics and the link below, after that, I have embraced spiritual reading as my number one pass time. I think it is important to daily read a spiritual book as part of your daily routine in life.
http://www.catholicapologetics.info/modernproblems/newmass/bugnini.html
Open Letter to Confused Catholics:
https://www.abebooks.co.uk/servlet/SearchResults?sts=t&cm_sp=SearchF-_-home-_-Results&tn=open%20letter%20to%20confused%20catholics
Catherine,
The Open Letter to Confused Catholics can be read online, linked right here on our blog, links page. To save time, for those who might find it useful to dip into, voila! Here’s said link!
http://www.sspxasia.com/Documents/Archbishop-Lefebvre/OpenLetterToConfusedCatholics/index.htm
Catholic Truth at your service…
Hello,
I must admit that I was drawn into the traditional movement, attending the LMS and SSPX for a number of years.
I am not opposed to the movement now but I have a number of observations. Firstly, YouTubers often comment on the phenominal growth of the Traditional Liturgy. Certainly since SP we have seen a great increase in the numbers of Masses being offered. However, I wouldn’t say that the Traditional Masses are packed to the rafters with standing room only (maybe on special occasions). Most LMS Masses are attended by the few. I do conceed that the traditional groups are, however, producing many vocations which is good.
The Traditional Mass isn’t great for evangelisation. The person who wanders in won’t find it accessible. On Palm Sunday the long Gospel is sung in Latin. If you cannot read or are blind I guess you just twiddle your thumbs or beads.
I was also getting fed up with the mindset of those who attend traditional Masses;
– the slagging off of the Holy Father
– the gossip
– the conspiracy theories, particularly regarding Covid
– sedevacantism
– Benedict is the real Pope etc
There are many good folk but too many negative , critical people who have their own interpretation of issues eg the validity of the russia consecration or novus ordo ordination rites.
This is a Protestant mentaity. In my mind, to be Catholic means to be in Communion with Peter and the Bishop’s throughout the World.
No wonder some have drifted to the SSPX Resistance as to distance yourself from the Catholic mainstream is to enter a maze. As soon as one is cut off from Rome you get on dangerous grounds. Eg. An SSPX priest telling their flock not to genuflect when they visited a Catholic Cathedral. A prominent priest of the SSPX saying it is like herding cats due to the plethora of views regarding the way forward with Rome.
Also the young men have a tendency to like dressing up as if they were from a bygone era. 1950s suits, ties and a pipe. Get real!
Some are so caught up on rubrics and furnishings. Who has the most lace?
I’m sure the editor will disagree but I don’t think the Church should be stuck in a bygone era.
If people do enjoy the traditional Mass I would say attend the FSSP or Institute. In emergencies attend the SSPX but just go to Mass and avoid the backstabbing over coffee.
Debs,
I think you’re probably right about the numbers not packing the churches for the Traditional Mass. Saying that, they’re not packing the churches for anything these days! The bishops have done all they can to make people think the Latin Mass is illicit and undesirable, that it’s more “faithful” to attend the novus ordo, so I suppose a combination of factors – including loads of people not even knowing there is such a thing as a Latin Mass – keeps the numbers low.
Funny you should say that you don’t think someone wandering in would find it accessible. One of the things that amazes me is hearing about converts who have taken to it immediately. There was the early Scottish Presbyterian convert who became a Bishop (Gray, I think his name was), he said that the minute he went to the Mass (the only one there was at that time, early in the 20th century) he knew that this was his home, sort of thing. Then the famous Communist convert, Hamish Fraser, said he knew right away that the novus ordo was off. I’ve read about other converts who actually loved the old Mass and were annoyed when it was replaced after V2. So, I suppose it’s swings and roundabouts.
I do agree there will probably be unpleasant people attending the Traditional Masses who can be less than Christian in the way they behave but I don’t think you can blame the Mass for that! Great canonised saints attended that Mass, so you might say it’s six of one and half a dozen of the other. Maybe you could name a place where there is “backstabbing” over coffee, so I can avoid it. I’ve only met pleasant people who made me feel welcome, and I’ve gone to quite a few now.
I don’t have any experience of seeing young men with pipes and dressing up. That must have passed me by, LOL!
Yes, I agree, the main thing is to attend the old Mass, doesn’t matter whether it’s the FSSP, SSPX or whatever. After you attend for a while, you just don’t want to go back to the novus ordo, strange as it may seem. I’ve heard a few people saying that.
Debs,
No time to answer your lengthy comment right now – indeed, not much left to answer; I think Fidelis has done a great job there, but I notice that LGBTQ+ people talk a lot about “lace” when they mention the TLM. Is that why you mention it?
Hahaha yes I’m gay so possibly. Good point.
Just my personal experiences I’m noting. I also know many who have been converted through the traditional Mass and I agree that Roche has been bang out of order.
However, for those attending who aren’t Christian, I question the ability of the TLM as a key to evangelisation.
I think we can agree that the vast majority prefer the vernacular Mass? My personal preference is for the NO celebrated with dignity, preferably Eastward facing.
I do know there are gays in the traditional movement of course. One couple I know are in an inflluential position at the SSPX and involved with a conservative Catholic news website. They must be incredibly conflicted. One has been suicidal. I just wish there were more pastoral care than a “don’t ask, don’t tell” mentality.
“Deborah”
Thanks be to God the church I attend still has a healthy congregation. I’m sure numbers have decreased in other places due to covid restrictions and people not returning.
However, proportionally speaking the tlm has so few attend. See the pre covid LMS annual Mass photos. Westminster Cathedral is pretty empty. That’s for a national Mass!
SSPX? Probably 1k-2k (ie size of a large london catholic parish) attend in the GB district. Chapels at Brighton and Oxford have recently closed.
Certainly retain the tlm but we need to get real over the numbers.
Debs,
I’ll respond to both of your recent comments here, if you don’t mind.
Firstly, since you appear to be regularly attending Mass, whether the TLM or novus ordo, and since you are openly “gay”, I take it you are a celibate “gay”? Like the rest of us who are unmarried, there is an obligation to pursue purity, the virtue which helps us to remain chaste – i.e. not sexually active in any way. I won’t lecture you about the conditions for absolution – some think if you confess and receive absolution before Communion, it’s OK to return to a publicly sinful lifestyle. I remember a relative of mine saying as much at a funeral where she had received Communion, despite living with her boyfriend and when it became obvious that she was still living with him, she used the excuse that the priest had absolved her right before the Mass began! That’s one of those cases where she will find out in due course that ignorance is NOT bliss! Like my unjust speeding ticket. When I thought of appealing because I hadn’t realised the limit stopped being 40mph halfway along that particular stretch of road, I realised that ignorance of the law is no defence. So I paid the (insert adjective) fine.
The poor conflicted souls (to whom you refer) are conflicted precisely because, in their deepest souls, they know that they are behaving in a way that is contrary to God’s natural moral law. This particular sin is widespread today, approved by society which serves as a smokescreen to give the impression of respectability. But that inner conflict is clear evidence that those who are living in that way, know, deep down, that they are displeasing God and won’t be happy in the (literally) longer term. And remember, eternity is a very long term..
Anyway, don’t look for pastoral care for anything in the SSPX. Just offer everything up… after gritting your beautiful white teeth 😀
As for this business of most people preferring the vernacular Mass. Well, that may be, but it’s not “most people” who matter – it’s God. The Mass/Liturgy is the worship of God and we must worship Him as He chooses. Not as “most people” choose… Look at what “most people” in this parish chose – pleasing to God? No way! I’ll finish with this – well, it’s cheerful, if not exactly edifying 😀
Certainly it is a difficult life. If we didn’t have gays within the church we’d lose the majority of clergy!
Editor: you are right there but those men should never have been ordained in the first place. The Church prohibits men who have any inclination to the homosexual lifestyle from entering seminaries so we are now experiencing the wrath of God in the priesthood because of the disobedience of seminary rectors and bishops to that prohibition.
The SSPX should be offering support especially as one of the men has had thoughts of suicide.
Editor: tell them, not me, Maybe they did and told them to stop living that sinful life. And maybe, then, the culprits think they didn’t get pastoral care because the priest(s) didn’t give their blessing to the homosexual partnership. Who knows?
Sadly the Church is obsessed with sex.
Editor: nope. the people pushing for a change to God’s moral law are obsessed with sex. The Church’s duty is to protect and promote the natural moral law. She must speak out to defend it when it is attacked by those of you who ARE obsessed with illicit and immoral sexual behaviour.
Gay relationships are about far more than that. The sexual side is insignificant compared to companionship. Yes I am living a celibate life- I’d rather have a cup of tea!
Editor: What you describe as “gay relationships” (i.e. companionship) is simply friendship. That’s perfectly fine. The Church has no issue at all with that.
The message from Catholic priests I have spoken to regarding loneliness have given a range of opinions including finding a boyfriend to taking up the piano!
Editor: as already said – they should never have been ordained in the first place. Avoid them or give them the phone number of a good piano teacher (female!)
Yes, I agree that many liturgical abuses take place within the Dioceses.
Rather than TC , Francis should have firstly clamped down on these abuses.
Editor: agreed. I am signing off now, unable to comment further on any discussions today. Up to my pretty little eyes. God bless…
Comments are closed.