New English Cardinal: Critics of Vatican II In Danger of Being No longer Catholic But Protestant

New English Cardinal: Critics of Vatican II In Danger of Being No longer Catholic But Protestant

From The Tablet…

Pope Francis greets new English Cardinal Arthur Roche, prefect of the Dicastery for Divine Worship and the Sacraments, during a consistory for the creation of 20 new cardinals yesterday.

England’s new cardinal says those who are “stubbornly opposing” the liturgical reforms of the Second Vatican Council are in danger of adopting a position that is no longer Catholic.

Cardinal Arthur Roche, the Prefect of the Dicastery for Divine Worship and Discipline of the Sacraments, became the third English cardinal to be created by Pope Francis after he received his red hat during a ceremony in St Peter’s Basilica on 27 August.   Continues…  

Your thoughts…

 

Comments (24)

  • Leitourgos Reply

    Enter the ventriloquist’s dummy, stage left. How those red robes become him, and to think that they only cost thirty pieces of silver.

    Arthur, Arthur, the Lord has prayed for you …

    August 28, 2022 at 9:57 pm
  • Marinaio Reply

    The whole “show” was rather disconcerting. They drag Pope Benedict XVI out of his monastery seclusion in a forgotten corner of the Vatican, and have papal minder “Gorgeous George” Ganswein standing behind the pope “emeritus,” providing cues. First, Francis walks up and pats Pope Benedict on the head, then each of the new cardinals, in turn, say a word to Pope Benedict. But the most bizarre part of the whole thing (after they pretend to be Catholic and sing the Salve Regina), was that both popes, at the same time, give their blessing. In unison!

    It reminds one eerily of Lucia’s words regarding the third secret. Lucia said that there were two bishops dressed in white, and that they appeared as “people appear in a mirror when they pass in front of it”. Lucia further stated that “we had the impression that it was the Holy Father.” Watch the blessing at the end of this clip and see if the hair doesn’t stand up on the back of your neck.

    Here is an overview of the ceremony:

    https://twitter.com/EWTNews/status/1563576790634795009?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1563576790634795009%7Ctwgr%5Ec67323cbdc08cbcd9258d19393aff3cea4f8839c%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ncregister.com%2Fcna%2Fnew-cardinals-and-pope-francis-pay-visit-to-pope-emeritus-benedict-xvi

    August 28, 2022 at 10:40 pm
  • Andrew Q Reply

    Duplicitous Arthur says that the Latin Mass if 1962 is still available for those who want it. He omits that he is charged with eradicating it as soon as possible and that his department is routinely refusing faculties to say it.

    August 28, 2022 at 10:44 pm
  • Marinaio Reply

    Apparently neo-Cardinal Roche can’t figure out what drew Shia LeBeouf to become enamored of the TLM. His comment is toward the end of this short article on Gloria TV:

    https://www.gloria.tv/post/HD4ywXx2jAPb2XmqTjw2k1zwa

    And speaking of Shia LaBeouf, it seems that the the leftist “Slate” website has really been triggered over his apparent conversion. The Slate takes aim at the TLM, whose adherents (they say) can be “deeply toxic”. The Slate considers Mr. LaBeouf’s conversion to be “scandalous”. Here is the link to the disgusting article, the reading of which may actually lower your IQ a few points:

    https://slate.com/human-interest/2022/08/shia-labeouf-catholicism-conversion-latin-mass-scandal-explained.html

    August 28, 2022 at 11:52 pm
    • editor Reply

      Marinaio,

      Many thanks for those links, especially the Slate article. That any conversion would be regarded as “scandalous” is unusual, to put it mildly, but scandalous because apparently LaBeouf was moved primarily by his experience of the TLM is nothing short of diabolical. It’s yet one more example of the upside-down, back-to-front world and Church in which we now live and move and try to keep the Faith.

      August 29, 2022 at 8:40 am
  • graeme taylor Reply

    This recent elevated prelate is not going to set the heather on fire. He is just another of that generation, delusional and still seeking the “springtime” that is all of their own making and not of God.
    The drastic decline in Mass attendance amongst his “very reverential liturgy” is there to see with any with eyes.
    I do not experience anger or rebellion at the Holy Sacrifice – just people in prayer.
    What I do experience in the local parish new Mass is a small group who have no clue what is going on in the Church and show no desire to find out. Just the kind of slothful and dozy people Card Roche appreciates as it allows his daydream to run smoothly. Clericalism and arrogance abounding, very sad.

    August 29, 2022 at 7:09 am
    • editor Reply

      graeme taylor,

      I’m very interested in your remark about parishioners who “show no desire to find out” what is going on in the Church. I had a chat with a reader just a day or two who was telling me about an incident when he heard some fellow parishioners speaking enthusiastically about the new priest coming to their parish, praising him to the skies. Our reader expressed his surprise that they were so praising this priest since he was named in Father Despard’s book, exposing the extent of homosexuality in the Church in Scotland. One of the women became quite agitated and repeatedly said “I wish you hadn’t told us that, I don’t want to know that.” She is typical of the brain-dead laity who want to keep priests on pedestals.

      Cardinal Roche will be pampered and revered by people like that woman… just because he’s a cardinal, just as that double-living priest will be revered by that woman and her ilk, just because he’s a priest. What these unthinking laity don’t realise is that, not only are they going to be held accountable for their rejection of the truth, but they are calling down coals of fire on the heads of those guilty clergy.

      August 29, 2022 at 8:50 am
      • westminsterfly

        Editor,
        I agree about the unthinking laity – the ‘pay, pray and obey’ types – who drive me crazy. The novus ordo church is rife with clericalism, and I’ve come across this kind of ‘Yes Father, No Father, Three Bags Full Father’ attitude among the laity so often. You know the types – Father (and sometimes Sister) can never be wrong, or ever be questioned – when in fact Father (or Sister) might be raving psychopaths. And it’s exactly that kind of attitude that leads to abuse – and not just of the liturgical kind . . .
        Such parishioners treat churches as social clubs and the MOST important thing is that everyone just gets on and especially everyone has to get on with Father. I’ve seen it with my own eyes. Little fan clubs form around the priest and the priest does nothing to discourage it. The Novus Ordo and the Cult of Personality feed into each other, no doubt about it.

        August 29, 2022 at 4:45 pm
      • Faith of Our Fathers

        ED i spoke of this Judas a few months back and called Him The Horrible Arthur Roche and i stand by that ,as i have a friend who worked beside this Judas years ago and when i asked what type of Man Roche was and His answer was ” Roche is a terrible Man ” and now it really shows. He is a career Clergyman who when younger was actually more at Home Dancing on Ice than being a Priest ,now this Apostate Bergoglion calls us Protestants . Well Roche my answer to a Judas like you is this . I am certainly no Saint but al take my chances before Almighty God that i am not for changing ,nor for following any garbage in Our Catholic Church ,not yours or Bergoglios Catholic Church .
        Just an another note . Yesterday i was at Roches beloved N.O. as our Bishop as you know ED cancelled our T.L.M. There was a Family in front of me ,1 Boy and 3 Girls . The Boy giggled and jumped up and down on the Kneelers all during Mass. Whilst one of the Girls actually had Her foot wrapped under Her Leg up on the Seat .
        Now our P.Priest has done his best to renew the kneelers and seats and they treat them like this. I never got a chance to talk to him after Mass but God Spare i will do at our T.L.Mass on Thursday night. Some havent even the respect to respect Gods House as am pretty sure their Parents [ the Father was with them ] wouldnt let them act the same with the furniture in their own home . One other thing is the way that the kneelers are banged up and down before and after the Eucharist . They really have no respect.
        P.S. I wonder if the same things happened in Roches Parish. B.T.W. I cannot give Roche respect as respect has to be earned .

        August 29, 2022 at 5:04 pm
      • Josephine

        Faith of our Fathers,

        I don’t know how you can suffer the novus ordo with all that carry on going on, a constant reminder that you are at a Mass that is not pleasing to God, because it was created to make us Protestants, they told us that, which is why it’s hilarious to find Roche worrying that attending the old Mass makes us Protestants, LOL!

        August 29, 2022 at 5:57 pm
      • Faith of Our Fathers

        Josephine i agree with all that you say ,but living where i am and having no transport am stuck so to speak. I know it wouldnt be my choice ,but i feel i have to fulfil my Sunday Obligation. I know others on here have said i need not go to the N.O. especially with our Bishop cancelling our Sunday T.L.M. and am giving it serious thought.
        It was more the feet on the seat and standing on the kneelers that got to me more than anything else . As both the kneelers and the seats were re upholstered just over a year ago at a considerable cost.

        August 29, 2022 at 8:12 pm
  • westminsterfly Reply

    +Roche – The embodiment of diabolical disorientation.

    August 29, 2022 at 8:04 am
    • editor Reply

      WF,

      In the proverbial nutshell – you have hit the nail on the head.

      August 29, 2022 at 8:42 am
  • Frankier Reply

    What a shock that is. I thought we were already protestant.

    If being declared protestant is such a terrible thing, why do they cow-tow to them so much?

    I wonder what he would think if the leader of the COE declared all his “dissidents” to be now Catholics.

    I hope he allows us to choose which branch of the protestant church we fancy, or even allow us to be Jewish, Muslim or Hindu.

    August 29, 2022 at 4:17 pm
    • RCAVictor Reply

      Frankier,

      “If being declared protestant is such a terrible thing, why do they cow-tow to them so much?”

      What a great catch! To which might be added a couple of things: one, these leftist clergy are guilty of the same psychological self-deception as secular, political leftists: projection. They will never admit that the Novus Ordo is a bankrupt, Protestantized mish-mash that has destroyed the Faith, so instead they project and pronounce us guilty of that which they themselves are guilty.

      I believe that’s also called “gaslighting.”

      Two, I’ve often read about the “self-loathing” of the Jews springing from the guilt of having rejected and executed their Messias. It seems clear that this same self-loathing is at work in the modern hierarchy. Could it be the result of guilt at having betrayed the Faith at Vatican II?

      August 29, 2022 at 5:00 pm
      • Faith of Our Fathers

        Victor the Horrible Roche is maybe not even the Top Pick of this motley crew as am sure that Robert McElroy would even pip Roche to the Post as far as both of these Apostates Histories are concerned. O and just in case any of you missed it ,Jimmy Martin He of the LGBT2+Q+WXWYZETC ,has been given another 5 Year Term at Vatican Dicastery for Communion . A bit like putting A Fox in Charge of a Henhouse.
        I really mean this and am sure others on here especially would agree with me. Were i offered a free Holiday in Rome that meant going to The New Babylon i would turn it down.

        August 29, 2022 at 5:47 pm
  • Michael 🙏 Reply

    Dear friends

    More diabolical machinations from the Vatican. God help us.

    Every blessing

    Michael 🙏

    August 29, 2022 at 5:02 pm
  • Michael 🙏 Reply

    Dear friends

    I find the Cardinals remarks to be profoundly bizarre. We are to accept the comments of an individual who openly supports doctrinal and ethical positions which are an anathema to the orthodox supernatural Catholic faith.

    In addition he distorts the truth. the Latin rite of Mass was never abrogated at Vatican 2 and the new order of the Mass is what it is a rite that represses new order terms of faith, liturgy and even sacramental ecclesiology.

    Far from us adopting a Protestant stance he would do well to look into his own conscience. It is he and his Modernist/ Masonic cohorts in the Vatican who are the real enemy of the Catholic faith and through their false teachings they are sadly dragging souls to hell.

    Ave Maria!

    Every blessing

    Michael 🙏

    August 29, 2022 at 5:15 pm
    • Josephine Reply

      Michael,

      “Bizarre” is the word – one minute the new Cardinal Roche is saying we have access to the missal of 1962, so what are we complaining about, sort of thing, and the next he is saying we are Protestants if we access it! LOL!

      August 29, 2022 at 6:00 pm
  • Faith of Our Fathers Reply

    Roche forby being a Horrible Man ,it seems is also a Liar .He says and i quote ” The Latin Mass is still there for those who wish to go to it ” . No it is not Roche and you and the Godfather along with the rest of the lackeys seem intent on destroying anything that is good and Holy within Our Catholic Church. Most of us have our own reasons for why you lot are trying to do this.

    August 29, 2022 at 6:22 pm
  • Hebdomadae Reply

    Well that’s a laugh coming from him!

    August 30, 2022 at 1:05 pm
  • FDS Reply

    i had seen a clip of video re cardinals walking in twos inside St Peters church.

    Well i have stopped reading any news on PF or his cardinals or bishops cos they are ‘ protestant’ in some form. Their actions or decisions were so protestant, not even remotely catholic.

    Roche was bishop of Leeds who had spent hugely as it was left to his successor to raise monies to cover the loss of money incurred by Leeds diocese.

    He’s a protégé of CMOC and also a member of saint Gallen mafia cos he’s their secretary at that time. One thing i heard was Cardinal Nichols didn’t like him cos he was afraid of church politics.

    Once PF is gone, Roche might be moved to London to replace Nichols.

    August 30, 2022 at 3:46 pm
  • editor Reply

    This, from the Rorate Caeli blog, is very interesting – a visit back to the 70’s, when Michael Davies, famous convert who fought for the provision of the TLM in England, responds to a disgraceful letter by a fully fledged modernist bishop. How he got to be fully fledged even at that early stage in the revolution, is curious, to say the least. It means there were plenty of priests and bishops who had lost the Faith even at that time, just after the Council (and probably before)…
    https://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2022/08/michael-davies-in-1976-my-lord-this-is.html

    September 1, 2022 at 6:34 pm
  • Gabriel Syme Reply

    Roche is every bit the buffoon Francis is and ought to be ignored for the sake of one’s blood pressure.

    Thank heavens we will not need to tolerate Francis and his shoddy shower of Cardinal-sycophants forever.

    Apparently Roche has had a grudge against the journalist Damian Thompson, ever since the latter revealed Roche had been a figure skater (!) before his clerical career.

    September 1, 2022 at 9:02 pm

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